So, we generally don't like homework. Everybody knows that.
There has been rising concern that kids today do too much homework.
One of the "rules" I've seen is that it is reccomended 10 minutes of homework per night per grade level. The educators I know of completely disregard this reccomendation starting at 4th grade.
In my experience, I hardly ever had homework in first or second grade. Then I moved to a different part of the county and went to a different elementary school. This was a big transition in my life. In third grade, I had some homework every night, usually math problems. Now, I can see that third grade is level where they start giving more homework, but there was a big difference between the two schools I attended. The first one, where I spent kindergarten through second grade, was a very warm and friendly environment. The second one, where I spent 3rd-5th grade, was the school that had the highest standardized test scores in the county.
In 4th grade, I entered Signet, the gifted education program. In my county, 1st through 3rd graders who are believed to be gifted are put in a program called Start, and at the end, one takes a test to determine if they are truely considered gifted enough for Signet.
Well, the point of that is, Signet was every Monday and lasted almost all day. So, because we missed so much class time, we had a ton more homework to do that night. Sometimes, the teachers were a little inconsiderate in their planning and gave quizzes or tests on Mondays, and we had to take even more classtime out to make those up. There was one Signet session where we discussed the problems of being in it, and the main thing was that there was so much homework and the teachers made it seem like a punishment.
5th throough 7th grade, I played the violin. This added practicing the instrument to the homework load, which was reasonable. In 8th grade, I dropped orchestra for several reasons, and at the end of the school year, I was glad I did because I wouldn't want to practice on top of the homework I had (I was taking two high school level classes, too). I don't remember much about the total homework load, but I finished between 5 and 6 PM or so.
11th grade is the year where my homework load was a problem. I had a heavy courseload, which consisted of AP English 11, Functions/Trigonometry, French IV, Art III, Art IV, Chemistry, and US & VA History. As soon as the year started, I knew I shouldn't have taken French IV, but I was afraid to drop it because I had no idea what I'd take instead. I managed to get a B or B+ for the year. History was the easiest, and that math was the hardest. I failed the math midterm, got a D on the final, and got a C overall for the year.
That year, I'd start my homework around 3 PM, and finish past 7PM on a typical day. I'd often be memorizing French orals or math formulas while watching primtime TV. It wasn't unusual for me to be even working past 8 PM. There was also a combination of severe anxiety, overthinking, and a "disability" working against me. If I had a job or played a sport that year, there was no way I could've gotton all that work done.
I was very fustrated in Art IV--I produced many projects that were below my standards. The projects were difficult, I couldn't take as much time as I wanted due to all the other work I had to do, my creative process is slow, and because of all that, I often put something together just for the sake of doing something and turning it in.
Throughout the year in 11th grade, I was very anxious about going to school, and as the school day drew to an end I became anxious about doing all the homework I had to do.
I considered transferring because the staff at my school continously failed to listen to my complaints about being bullied (this started in 9th grade), and I have a lot of strong opinions pertaining to that matter that are a factor in my difficulties at school.
Now, in my county, the school schedule is like this, give or take 10 minutes:
Elementary (K-5): 9:00 AM - 3:30 PM
Middle (6-
: 8:30 AM - 2:50 PM
High (9-12): (arrive at 7) 7:30 AM - 2:00 PM
Give another 30 or so minutes each for the bus ride back and forth.
This year, I'm in 12th grade, and take only 4 (easy) classes. Every other day I get out at either 10:04 or 12:20, and I have very minimal homework.
We had a class discussion about too much homework the other day in English (my principal teaches the class). Some kids said they have younger siblings in elementary school that come home around 4:30 and have three hours worth of homework to do. And, some of those kids are learning disabled or ADHD and the process takes longer.
The principal brought up that kindergarten and first grade aged kids are excited to go to school, yet within a few years, this goes away.
The article this discussion stemmed from asserted that homework in elementary school is not beneficial at all unless it is reading or practice. It also said that doing homework for over two hours is not helpful, either.
Today, I was going over this with my therapist, and she (who sees mostly kids and teens) confirmed that there are elementary school children doing over 3 hours of homework a night. IMO, that's ridiculous. You shouldn't expect a young child to do hours of homework in the evening after sitting through seven hours of school.
Do you think there is too much homework? Or does it prepare one for having a job in real life?
Do any of you have more difficulties with home or schoolwork due to a disablity, condition, or just plain have a hard time? Does homework ever come in conflict with another activity?
Homework is a necessary part of the school curriculum.
If it interferes with someone's social life, too bad for them.
Now I haven't read up on the amount of homework and how much is too much and whatnot, but two-four hours of homework in High school sounds pretty reasonable. Don't know about the little kids though, because I really can't remember having much homework at all until like Grade 6.
Unless I was teaching those in possibly 2nd grade or lower, I'd probably disregard that 10 minute rule myself. I might add 3rd, but due to mandatory testing going on in this country starting with 3rd grade--that wouldn't happen for many reasons.
"Too much" or "too little" homework is in the eye of the beholder. Homework that might take one kid a couple of hours will take another kid less than a half hour. It's not any different from the fact that there will be some people who can hear/see/do something once and get it while others can hear/see/do it a million times and still not get it.
If you are taking advanced classes in high school, especially ones that are supposed to be "college level," there's absolutely no reason to be complaining about homework that takes awhile. That's what taking college-like classes is all about particularly since college work usually does take awhile unless taking an "easy" class.
Homework conflicting with anything that is not a necessity for life (and most things we do aren't necessities), really is on the person. It's called prioritizing--making homework a "preparing for life lesson." Especially now as part of the "real world," I don't get to do things I'd like to do all the time. Sometimes, I have to do what I don't want to do and "sacrifice" things I'd like to do. Homework is one of many good teachers of that life skill from school. ;p
Unless you're doing a trade, homework/school only prepare for life in terms of making you think and causing you to make decisions about priorities and what matters to you--something that differs from person to person. However, being able to think and make decisions are extremely important.
Personally, I had homework every night once I entered into the public school system at 2nd grade. If I had entered it at kindergarten, I would've had homework every night from then. How long it took always varied on what I had to do and how good at it I was--if it was math-related, I'd finish quickly. If I had to write, it'd take awhile. Doing homework until 7-8pm happened at times in elementary (always due to writing). Other than hating it because I'd miss my afternoon cartoons, I lived. Other people are the opposite of me, others will take awhile no matter what, and others will be done quickly regardless.
I can slightly understand the whole "little kids shouldn't do so much work" to an extent. My extent ends at the obvious fact that we're all different and will take a different amount of time to do things. My extent also ends at the complaining about having to think to do homework, which is probably a factor in things taking longer due to the whole "less memorization, more abstract thinking" memo that has affected teaching to a degree relatively recently. Unless you have a really silly teacher, all homework is practice at the very least. Still, as long as there's mandatory testing with people worrying about their jobs due to those testing results, there's going to be "more" homework for the elementary kids.
Homework (or anything) taking longer or being more difficult for some with certain disabilities/conditions is a fact of life. Many things in life will be difficult for people with certain disabilities/conditions. Each learns to adjust in whatever way he/she needs. They all survive. If they feel that they need something special, they ask and it'll either be accepted or denied. Either scenario is a "life lesson" because that's what happens in life.
Hmm. Lets add the view of someone with no homework and does there work on a computer.
Reading for 1--15 minutes I can understand. Doing maybe 30 minutes of homework I can understand. The problem is, 2/3rds of school is filler. I can do 6 hours of work in under 2, and not just because I'm smart. When schools are straining to find crap to fill in time (IE here we had 2 42min periods of math, one of which was a review for the very few who are kinda slow, no offense to them intended). Then we have bogus class about studying and beign organised, which if you can't do by middle/high school, youve got some serious issues. Throw in 2 42 blobs of "related arts" (art, gym, wood working, IT class, music, etc.) Then a 42 minute study hall thing.
Now I have nothing against doing an art/gym/etc thing, but 84 minutes is al ot of time in a day to devote to somethig like that. Same for the bogus class the call "L.E.A.D" (don't get me started). A class that goes on about stuff you shoudl already know (besides what I mentioned, its almost like an extra thing for language arts. Now that fills up a 6hour day.
Its obviously not needed. After all, when you have people doing a days work in 2 hours average, there is something wrong. Hence why there is often way more homework given than needed. So why give students even more stuff to do at home? Because it can be used to eat up tiem in class. Some people may need it to help them ok. Maybe if they cut out all the extra crap in the day those pople could not only do that stuff in school, but get help from trained people while there at it.
What I'm trying to get at is as much is supposively done in a day, you shouldn't need much homework (excluding studying of course). Hence if students need homework that badly to help them, schools need to redistribute their time, so maybe over an hour of homework isn't needed. And it can be proved with a cyber school student like me. If I can do the work in much shorter time, and not need extra homework, and still get As on tests and top scores on state and national tests, it calls into quiestion how much homework is actually needed.
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My motto is: You can't teach common sense,
Perhpas, but you can teach analytical skills. When you take notes, you develop an ability to read a text, understand what is noteworthy, and organize the relevant information in a format that will allow you to refer back to it if necessary.
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I don't care what 'AP' classes you have, if you can't remember to think to move your hand from a fire because it's hot, then what's the use of it?
I took AP English, which enhanced my ability to understand and interpret what I read. It also helped me develop my ability to organize my thoughts and set forth an agrument in an organized manner featuring both opinion and supporting evidence. I think that skill is extremely valuable.
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Of course, we live in a highly credentialized society, so unfortunately, common sense has no place. You just need to be able to regurgitate information on command.
This is false. Although regurgitation of information might get you through high school, it's not going to cut it elsewhere.
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My motto is: You can't teach common sense,
Ergo, we teach Psychology, which abandons all concepts of "common sense" for scientifically provable notions.
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My motto is: You can't teach common sense,
*giggles* Weren't you one the ones demonizing gays?
Anyway on topic. Like Kat said I've noticed that myself. My nephew in law has a little trouble focusing. If he's on the ball he'll blow through homework in 30 minutes and ace his tests in school. If he gets distracted, forget it.
It's school dependant really, I remember coming home with PILES of the stuff. Of course I had no social life until like 11th grade so I didn't care. But my cousins kids usually don't bring home that much.
Of course in this country k-8 grades have no impact on your adult life. It IS however training you on how to think, study, and socialize. Which is where homeschooling fails, but thats a tangent.
Psychology relies on repeatable evidence, its not always right but it's better we have some idea of whats going on with people than none, ay?
The issue with lower the amount of homework in a school is that less homework means more time to cause trouble. As a whole my generation is turning out to be ABYSMAL parents. It's probably in part their fear of one mistake on their part leading to their kids being taken away. The fault of child services being over zealous. So because of that fear they have a tendancy to only put their foot down when they absolutely HAVE too.
Anyway, like I said its school dependant from what I've experienced. And even at that it's usually teacher dependant. You can't judge the whole system based on one teacher's style. I had a trig teacher in COLLEGE that let us grade our own homework. AFTER they gave us the answers. And note this wasn't some class were it was all about the mechanics, it was just plain high school trig. Should I judge all teachers based on that one's style? I made a 100 in the class without even thinking about homework.
~Rico
I don't think I made this clear in my original post--I generally don't mind doing homework. The times in my experience where I have felt it was excessive haven't occured very often. 11th grade was the one year where it was really piled on, and I felt like I barely had time to stop and breath. There were some times where I thought I wasn't going to be able to get it all done, but I did.
I'm going to elaborate on my opinion about elementary school kids and homework. I think they should have homework, but they should also have time to play outside and just be kids. In my area, there are many kids who don't get home until 4:30, and that doesn't leave much daylight time left. When I was that young, my bedtime was 8:30, though I don't know what the standard bedtime is for young children is.
Time is another issue. Generally, younger kids like to wake up early, and teenagers like sleeping late. Some people are pushing for elementary school to start early and get out early, and high school to start late and get out late. My only beef with that is I don't want to start a high school load of homework at 4:30 or so PM, and I don't like staying up past 10 PM on school nights.
Though, some kids need to do extra work. I've skimmed other articles on this, and one issue is that some of the kids who really need to do more work don't live in a homework suitable environment.
Other times, it's the opposite. I recall my mother complaining about one of my older brothers understanding multiplication and division, and still *had* to draw a little picture for every problem.
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The issue with lower the amount of homework in a school is that less homework means more time to cause trouble.
That's what after-school programs and Boys & Girls Clubs are for. I'm not sure if everyone has access to those, though.
There are also a bajillion different things you could sign up your kids for, but those cost money.
One friend told me that Snoop Dogg is advocating free Little League is an attempt to keep kids out of gangs.
AP English, wow, that's a story.
In 11th grade, I signed up for regular English 11 for less stress. Then when school started, my parents and teachers thought I needed to transfer to AP English. Their theory was that I'd be less stressed around more mature students. So, they switched me to AP English, and I had to do the summer assigment (read The Scarlet Letter, do some writing activities) on top of the regular schoolwork. Overall, it caused more stress. Throughout the year, I had trouble with those AP essays, and there were several that I just couldn't do, which left 0's in the gradebook (still passed the class with a B+). I never recieved the results of the AP test, I think it's because I only did one out of the three essays. X__X;
When we were doing scheduling for 12th grade (this year), we decided to pick the least stressful classes. I went with Oceanography because I didn't want to bother with Physics, no French, no Art, Advanced Math because Func/Trig was too hard the previous year, non-AP US Government, but Mom thought I should go ahead with AP English 12. She said that whatever I do when I'm older, it's going to be arts-orientated, and I could use the class. So, the summer assignment was to read a book about how to read books, read and annotate Great Expectations (this will be graded), write some stuff, and be prepared to write an essay the first week of school. During this past summer, I read the first book, and right when I finished it, my parents told me they were very worried about me being in AP English. Mom was even losing sleep over it. I said, "I agree." That was it. They contacted the school about it, and got out of AP English. Thank God I didn't have to do the rest of the summer assignment. And, my regular English 12 teacher happens to be the principal, so I don't have to put with crap from other students.
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Quote:My motto is: You can't teach common sense,
Ergo, we teach Psychology, which abandons all concepts of "common sense" for scientifically provable notions.
Psychology, as much as I love it should be called science with quotation marks. It involves experiments, but drawing conclusions from those experiments is very subjective.
Common sense as you're saying is nonsense. It's just a bunch of culturally prescribed biases.
The best subject to teach at early levels is sociology. Because I want to indoctrinate people to not accept being indoctrinated. A cultural paradox! Questioning the message would in fact be passing with flying colors.
Most homework sucks. It's just busywork that's supposed to make you a cog in the machine.
One of the best instructors I ever had ran the whole class on tests. Yes, we had homework, but it was optional. The homework was intended as study for the class. And I actually did it, with some enthusiasm, in that case. Oh, how I've loved test-based classes in school and college.
I know some people hate the arts/gym but those are not wasteful classes. The arts (music and art) require a different set of thinking skills. It's about more than being a "good" musician or artist. Gym is for exercising the body, which needs to be worked out as much as the brain.
Tests are only good for some people. I went to school with a girl who was extremely bright but couldn't pass a test to save her life. Tests created a bit of anxiety for her that most other forms of assessment didn't. While I know she was an "extreme" case, test-only classes are a sure fire way to keep some people from ever advancing.
IMO, it depends on the subject. Saying "tons of homework is good" or "all homework is bad" is too generic. Things like math or foreign languages, things that require learning how to do it and practice, should have enough homework to refresh. Not much, just enough to get it all into your mind again. Things like history and Lit, it's stuff you should learn in schools. You don't need to practice Washington crossing the Deleware. But you DO need to practice speaking in foreign languages.
So a little bit, maybe an hour or so, of math, foreign languages, possibly some things in science, is something I'd consider as useful homework - Because you just need to be familiar with how to do it. And that requires doing it more than once a day (once every other day for me, we use two schedules.) But stuff that basically requires memorization, or common logic, is best left in schools.
