I'm kinda curious, so far has this thread changed anyone's beliefs on this (harden, question, or change their stance one way or another)?
Hmmm...no not really changed, more or so strengthened. 
It has wholeheartedly solidified my faith in Allah.
loljk
XD! Yes, yes. Definitely. It more or less has made me believe in the fire and water gods. >_>
if Chaos and Iblis fought each other would they both cancel out into billows of really hot steam?
I believe so, yes. 😛 Kudos to catching my reference. 😛
All hail the Sauna?
Hahah! *high fives*
o.O To summarize then.
Shadow can do Chaos control cuz he was built to do so. (I havent played Shadow, so I dun know that back story very well, nor do I think its even intelligible writing -.-)
Sonic can do Chaos Control because of his years with playing with them, and knowing he can do anything Shadow Can, so he can do it even with fake emeralds because his own Chaos energy is enough. (Kinda like Kamehameha's-focus all your inner energy to one point, only its into this little rock that somehow amplifies that energy allowing you to telelport >>.......)
Tails and Knux get shafted like red-headed stepchildren at mealtime. Knux especially, he can't even climb walls anymore (He climbs ladders? What?)
Sonic died in S2K6? Yeah, explainananana?
I can Chaos Control becuze I lived and learned it :o.
As for everyone else...wait can't Blaze Solar Control then, since she rocked with the Sol emeralds? *shot*
Yeah, Ima stop now, my lulz are dying.
HAHAHAHAH! Redheaded stepchildren AT mealtime. =P And Knux climbs ladders? Ummm...wow! Is that what they have him doing in Sonic 2K6? Sonic Team!!!! Yea I can CC because I live and learned it. So I suppose it'll work for you too. >_>
I think Shadow was remarking on Sonic's mad skillz (Project Shadow's goal was to create the ultimate life form and made it seem like that was the same as an immortal life form; Sonic died in Sonic 2006 - obviously he's not immortal)
Well that really depends on what you consider immortal. You have immortals that can't die in no way, shape, or form and then you got immortals who can't die from disease or old age but are just as able to die from a bullet or other instruments as us mortals.
As for everyone else...wait can't Blaze Solar Control then, since she rocked with the Sol emeralds? *shot*
She can I believe. When she was leaving Sonic's world/time period, Sonic either said directly or hinted at that Blaze could use the Sol Emeralds to warp to their world anytime and visit them.
And Knux climbs ladders? Ummm...wow! Is that what they have him doing in Sonic 2K6? Sonic Team!!!!
No, the climbing ladders bit comes from Chronicles which is supposedly his special ability in the field of the game, but I hope that was just bad info and that climbing walls is his actual field ability!
Ahh ok, I see. Thanks Ray. 
No problem, Neal. 
About Dark Light's summary:
Actually nobody really argued that Shadow can use it, they said they think he can because he was allegedly built to, so to really summarize: strong case was made for needing an Emerald's power for Chaos Control, but nobody was that interested and jumped off topic. Good lulz thou, red-headed stepchildren at mealtime pwned
It may be mysterious about how Shadow uses Chaos Control, but I can say things that might describe its effects. I will use some Hard Science here. So don't be surprised if this seems complicated.
When Shadow uses Chaos Control, he manipulates time and space. Now a little explanation.
Albert Einstien, The world's most famous physicist, came up with two of the most well known theories on science history, General and Special Relativity.
In his General Relativity theory, Einstien showed that Space and Time are one of the same. In other words, they make the 4 dimensions.
On a side note, however, Einstien said that 'spacetime tells matter where to move and matter tells spacetime where to curve' in other words, SpaceTime bends to matter within it.
SpaceTime, according to the Jewish, German physicists, bends the more mass (or more matter in an object) increases. The best example of this is the sun, planets and galaxies that move around each other like they are caught in a net (in other words, revolving in their orbits).
Finally, Einstien said that the main ingredient of bending space-time was the force we are all familiar with; gravity. Gravity is not just a force that keeps you to the ground, but Einstien said that it is what cause space-time to bend to moving matter. This is supposedly how planets move around one another.
The best known example of a body with so much gravity is the ever famous 'black hole'. Einstien predicted that Black holes, which form from collapsed stars as theorized, have so much gravity; not only is it immeasurable, but light cannot escape. At the very center of a black hole, a singularity; a seemingly dense mass, exists. It is so powerful, the laws of all known physics cease applying.
It may seem hardcore science to you, but if you can understand...it would be logical to say that Shadow's Chaos Control ability lets him manipulate gravity on a very powerful level.
Questions and Comments are welcome.
Your overthinking this. The Gravity effect of Chaos Control is not the main effect but rather would be a logical side effect.
Chaos Control is simply a method of drawing and utilising energy from an extremely potent source, the Chaos Emeralds, much like Robotnik's machines do but on a higher level. This can then be channeled through Shadow's body in two ways.
For effects like the Chaos Spear and such, it's simply a release of energy as directed heat and light.
The teleportation/time dilation is a little trickier. It's obviously an extension of using this energy to accelerate to extreme speeds, however as you highlighted reletivity earlier, it should be mentioned that the faster you go, the slower time passes in your frame of reference. As such when he's beginning to approach the speed of light, for Shadow, time isn't passing much at all so he's got plenty of time to unleash his kungfu skills. Which will really hurt as he'll be getting more massive due to the acceleration, which would cause the gravity side effect you noted as well as give him mind boggling momentum.
So really the question isn't how Chaos Control works. It's by what physical mechanisms can a living being use power like that and how does he not liquify himself with the acceleration?
I can see that, Crimson Darkwolfe.
Let me say that however this is flawed, this is not in game physics. What I said may have to be the mechanisms and not how it works, but I would not say that what I said applies in the games.
I just wanted to have a little fun posting this, not to make an actual lecture.
And I just wanted the mental image of Shadow turning into jelly with an attempted Chaos Control, so it's all good =3
In the world of Sonic scienitific golbelty guk means nothing all that matters is shiney emeralds super powered furries & crazy seizureific speed.
...not to mention those scientists never exixted in sonics world & reality overall bends to what people belive is or isn't possible, but since sonic is so stubborn i'd doubt he'd listen to a bunch of eggheads anyway.
CAFFINE!!!!!
And again I say http://sonichqcommunity.yuku.com/topic/7250 . We seriously don't need two threads on this. o_O
And again I say http://sonichqcommunity.yuku.com/topic/7250 . We seriously don't need two threads on this. o_O
Fine with me!
They've merged!!! AHH!
It's a hoax!
TOPIIIC CONTROL!
well from reading what everyone wrote, i just had to be apart or this.
every seems to agree that the emeralds are incredible power sources , and that in just being near the emeralds you can use there powers ex: metal madness(sonic heroes). If i may, in the sonic and the black knight sheds abit of light on the concept of chaos control. the character shadow plays is Lancelot of the round table and his soul surge called chaos punishment is the key example. in this attack Lancelot defies gravity while attacking enemies that are perfectly still possibly giving us a prime example that chaos control allows you to move fast while maintaining the user's body structure.
another thing is the emeralds role in sonic riders Babylon rouges and sonic (2006) soleonia suggesting that the emeralds were involved in possible multiple civilizations.
also i don't see why knux can't use cc if he can use the super transformation, though when u think about it not many villains even tried to use the emeralds power besides mephilies which shadow stated that mephilies power felt similar to his cc when he sent him to the future but may be when mephilies absorbed shadow's shadow he gained his powers. i'm just not all that sure, comments anyone?
TOPIIIC CONTROL!
AHAHAH! Hilarous! But yea sonic fan 53...I do'nt understand why Knux can't CC either. Or why he never goes Super at all. Like...if anyone should have a connection with the emeralds it would be him.
Silly people.
You should know by now that Chaos Control and Super mode are hedgehog exclusive. Blaze is merely an exception to the rule.
to Sailor Rose Dust:
interesting, than have do you explain knux, tails and possibly mecha sonic. i don't think the transformations are hedgehog only but rather others don't get a chance to try anymore
Dude, I'm quite sure she was being facetious in that regard.
to Sailor Rose Dust:
interesting, than have do you explain knux, tails and possibly mecha sonic. i don't think the transformations are hedgehog only but rather others don't get a chance to try anymore
As far as I know, Sega no longer considers S3&K canon. And Mecha Sonic was also a hedgehog, albeit a mechanical one. Of course I doubt Sega has any idea what's canon and what's not.
Are we to assume that SEGA no longer considers StH3&K simply because their games have not directly referenced it in the past few years? I think that's jumping the gun abit.
---the-Krayon
Right, Sonic Heroes more or less finalized the idea that Knux and Tails cannot Super Saiyan. Blaze seems able to only due to the Sol Emeralds, which is an entirely different kettle of fish.
Considering how degraded Angel Island is now compared to the one in S3&K, yeah, I'd say it's not considered canon, at least as far as the recent games are concerned.
The only areas kept as of SA1 was Icecap, and Red Mountain could be debated to be Lava Reef. But other than those two zones, nothing else was kept.
at this point i think it's safe to say that sega has reserved the super transformation to hedgehogs but remember reservations arean't always kept.
i'm just hoping the sega shakes up abit more with the emeralds, like give them more significance in the storyline
Wait, wait. I know the scale of Angel Island seems small in SA1, but think of it from the perspectives of the CGI scenes. It's not only far taller than the mountains of Mystic Ruins but has a mountain of it's own.
Mountains are in no ways small. I realize the perspective makes it look a lot different, but there's no evidence to suggest it's not the exact same place, particularly due to two known zones appearing in it. We are only limited to a small portion of it to explore.
That, and I would have to believe that the Jungle region from the Mystic Ruins might be part of Angel Island.
Check it out- that river in the background, in the section where Eggman built his Final Egg Base, also appears in the background of Angel Island Zone in Sonic Advance (or, at the very least, they based the background of the revamped Angel Island Zone on that scenery, which would STILL indicate it's meant to be part of the island)- AND those ruins ARE newly-discovered and all.... perhaps because they weren't THERE before? E
EDIT: Found a pic. Someone find me a screenie of the section in question from SA so we can compare. I tells ya, they're eerily similar... like an amalgalm of the Adventure Field version and the scenery you see from Lost World...
Also, about Sonic Heroes... well, I HATE to reference Sonic '06, but there Super Sonic ups Shadow and Silver to Super form. Maybe they ARE Super Tails and Super Knuckles, and Sega just decided to tweak the look?
They show the usual Super powers, and I wouldn't be surprised if they just wanted to streamline everything about the Super Forms to make them more similar to one another- look at Sonic Heroes as a WHOLE, how all the teams are essentially clones of one another.
Back on the subject of Angel Island, check the map of the Mystic Ruins:
Note how the Ice Cap and Red Mountain sections of Angel Island are essentially right next door to the jungle ruins. You could easily see them being part of where AI overlapped the mainland when it fell.
Still need that screenie of the landscape of the jungle section for comparison, though...
I think that Sonic Heroes doesn't definitively lean one way or another on the issue of super forms. While it is my opinion that we do indeed see Super Tails and Super Knuckles in Sonic Heroes (just as sonic332 mentioned), but even if they aren't and are simply using abit of Super Sonic's power that doesn't mean that they couldn't. The facts of the matter are that even is SEGA don't show them in Super form doesn't mean that they couldn't be in Super form.
I also believe that the whole of Angel Island as seen in Sonic 3 & Knuckles did fall in Sonic Adventure and, just as Craig said, the majority of the island simply isn't shown.
---the-Krayon
I'll give on Angel Island, but I refuse to believe that Knuckles and Tails went Super in SH.
I also believe they did not go super in Sonic Heroes. When I brought it up, I was referencing how they did not transform. I thought that was not a topic of debate, I guess I thought like an idiot.
They didn't go Super. They went like half Super or something.
Notice how it's usually two characters that always go super
Sonic/Chaos
Sonic/Shadow
Sonic/Blaze
Sonic/Tails with half/Knuckles with half as well
Now I know what you're thinking. But what about Sonic 06? Three characters went into super form. Well in 06, space and time was warped beyond belief.
to sonicV2:
what is your question exactly
What question? I didn't have a question.
ooo then what about "Now I know what you're thinking. But what about Sonic 06? Three characters went into super form. Well in 06, space and time was warped beyond belief."
He clearly had already anticipated that someone would ask it so he asked and answered it beforehand.
Rhetorical questions are rhetorical.
On the Angel Island issue, more than two zones are referenced post S3+K.
Mushroom Hill; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JuhnFhh6K_U&feature=PlayList&p=BCA9290E64FDF3B2&index=13
Jump to 7.00, Knux compares the Mushrooms in the 'Frog Forest' stage of Heroes to the ones on his island.
Sandopolis;
Tails Sand Hill minigame in Adventure? Not to mention I am sure some of the statues in the Desert stages in SA2 have Echidna heads.
Lava Reef;
Red Mountain in SA1. (Red mountain also has similar traps to Pumpkin Hill and Sky rail just fyi. That along with the Desert sugests to me Angel Island used to be connected to SA2s map.)
Launch Base; The first crash site of the Death Egg. Bit of a strech, but is this the 'Crater' Chaos appears from for no reason in Battle?
Ice Cap; Hmm, tough one.
Casino Night; In fairness I can see why they would want to keep the giant theme park always out of sight by mountains, clouds, plotholes etc.
Angel Island, Hydrocity, Marble Garden; All somewhat appear on the Advance games. Be it Advance1's Angel Island, Advance 3's Chaos Angel, or Battles Holy Summit.
As for the who is Super issue, in a Codex in Chronicles it is mentioned that Sonic, Shadow and most relevantly 'Knux and many others' can go super using the Chaos Emeralds. (Have not played the whole game yet, so no idea it actually comes into the story at some point.)
It could be referencing Heroes, or due to the lack of a direct mention to Tails it could be referencing S+K. But it does show that more than just Hedgehogs can go 'Super.'
For those who care, my opinion is that you may be able to go super, but you need someone who has a 'plot device' 'connection' with the emeralds to do so. Who just so happen to be Sonic, Shadow, and Knux, the three menioned in the codex.
I suppose the whole "Who can go super" arguement is moot at this point, given that optional transformations into Super mode have not existed for like 15 years now.
Thank you for the little Heroes blurb, by the by. I must have missed it, and it's nice to see references to Angel Island in this time where the place is rarely ackolwedged.
Launch Base; The first crash site of the Death Egg. Bit of a strech, but is this the 'Crater' Chaos appears from for no reason in Battle?
I'm quite sure it was stated in Battle that the "Crater" was the place that Angel Island originally was.
i would like to see more of angel island in futrue games with more detail on the landscaping
