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I was thinking I was going to be corrected about that. But until DDR Mario Mix there wasnt a dance mat for the Gamecube is what I meant.
Yeah there was-- it was just a crappy MadCatz pad that came with a game that a grand total of 2 people bought.
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For some reason, that didn't seem to sound right to me XD.
You're right. I think there's a Rouge joke to be had in there. 
Seriously though, I keep hearing about all these "new" questions being posed by the game. Short of a basic "What's gonna happen next," I don't see any major problems. What's bugging people?
Was there a remix of Final Chase's BGM anywhere in the game, because I remember hearing one for Final Rush on the The Ark level.
As for my view on the game, I agree with pretty much everything The Human Shadow said.
Not sure. I did notice that 2P battles use the Radical Highway music (Vengeance Is Mine). Doesn't sound like a remix. Also, story event music when Sonic invites Shadow on their... spaceship... is also from SA2 (Strategy).
As for non-musical Blasts From The Pasts, anyone who's been to Circus Park would know what those floating barrels remind you of... **shudder**
And, Craig, it DOES advance the series... It's explained some things about Shadow that Heroes left hanging
Spoilers (Select To Read): So how come it adds no conclusion on to wether Shadow is the real or the android or if he died or what. All Heroes did was bring up more questions and the resolution of Shadow was "forget about it"
I was EXPECTING a cop out, but it's like this game kept promising there would be resolution and instead they just made it even MORE confusing. I don't know what YOU walked away with, but for me it was nothing at all. I can easily disregard that entire game and continue along happy. Same as Heroes.
We never learned how/if he survived SA2, and if he's put his past behind him than his GERALD! NO U! attitude in Battle is uncanon (not that I was expecting Battle to be preserved) and his constant "...Maria"ness aswell.
I mean Shadow's character hasn't advanced, we have no clear inkling of his past (him knowing Maria was set in stone fact for anyone who had enough logic to realise the "you're not Shadow" scene was rebuteded in the game it was brought up when Biolizard was revealed as a prototype, Sonic X just screwed things up for people) he has no clear motives and what the hell was all of that "we're going to kill them so they can live" garbage about
Only true thing I can walk away with from this game is that anti-weapons Gerald can be justified in building Eclipse Cannon which preserves his Sonic Battle "good scientist" character, which would be nice if they didn't SUPER DEUS EX MACHINA his final message >.>
...
Well, I've already covered this earlier so I'm not going to bother to reiterate.
That reminds me... *backbackback highlightspoilerspsoilersspoilers*
Spoilers (Select To Read): Ah feckin' brilliant. Not only do they put the HUGE revelation which I was waiting for during the entire game 7 minutes into the final boss, where anyone with any form of skill would never see it (seeings as that Doom Devil made Overlord and Finalhazard wish THEY were they weak), but it also means that we have to accept "Sonic, I think the real ultimate life-form.... is you!" as if it happened.
Still, I like them showing Eggman in that light. That game gets 3 points for that dialogue and may be turned on again in the future so I can hear it 🙂
Just for the record, what is Eggy's line at that point? I don't recall hearing it and the game's gone back now...I think I know the general jist of it, but is there any chance of it being put up here? Paraphrased, if necessary, I guess.
🙁
Spoilers (Select To Read): "Shadow... Can you hear me...? This might be the last chance I have to speak with you, so... What I said...about having created you... It was all a lie... Everyone thought you'd died... during that horrible incident.... But I rescued you... With one of my robots... You'd lost your memory thats all. You really are the Ultimate Lifeform my grandfather created!"
But I cant get the spoiler tags working... UGH...
I've edited this six times or so now, still not working
Okay, I'm going to put a big warning here, and please, next mod who sees it stick in spoiler tags around the entire thing? Please...
BIG SPOILERS
What did we learn from that game:
Shadow WAS the real Shadow in Heroes, he just had amnesia
Shadow DID know Maria, he was created long before the Ark was destroyed... SA2 wondered whether she was a figment of his imagination
We now know how Gerald made Shadow, with Black Doom's help..
What I think I can work out from that:
Ladies and Gentlemen, I present, Shadow, a complete story from beggining to end:
It all starts with Gerald on the Ark, strugling to make the Ultimate Life Form, and doing a bad job...
It's never stated but presumably he made the Biolizard, a failure at the Ultimate Life Form, then Black Doom helped him make Shadow in return for gathering the seven chaos emeralds....
A young boy, who used to play with Maria saw Shadow being made and fled...
Gerald realised what Black Doom was doing and left a message warning Shadow that Black Doom would try and use him, he also realised the GUN troops were about to attack
GUN attacks, Maria is killed, Gerald goes mad and programs both shadow and the Biolizard to destroy the earth... Presumably Black Doom was sayng the same things to him that he was to Shadow "Humans are despicable" "This earth is abominable" "Unlesh your evil"
Gerald is captured, sentanced, and executed, but he dies happy knowing that his revenge will destroy the planet rather than Black Dooms
GUN seals the Biolizard away and Shadow is also encapsulated, frozen for 50 years as the Militaries Top Secret Weapon...
Eggman reawakens Shadow 50 years later, Shadow who is unsure about his past because of Geralds tampering with his memory heads straight to the Ark, begins collecting Chaos emeralds and nearly destorys the earth
Realising his mistake, when Amy reminds him of Maria, Shadow tries to undo the damage, but the Biolizard finishes his work and he is forced to kill it and nearly dies sing Chaos Control...
He passes out, falls to earth, is presumed dead and then found by Eggman.
Rouge discovers him and finds hes lost all of his memory, possibly from the fall or possible becuase he's undone the damage Gerald did to his mind tht he's overcome...
He goes his own way, his memories slowly returning...
(It is possible Sonic Battle could happen here, but I'm not sure.. In it Shadow knows just too much about Gerald... But then again, maybe it's fine)
The young boy who saw Shadow becomes leader of GUN, his hatred for the black hedgehog still burning despite what he just saw Shadow and Sonic do... (Im assuming he takes over AFTER SA2 as they clearly didn't know there were 2 hedgehogs at the start)
Black Doom arives, begs him to collect the emeralds and the invasion commences
Shadow collects the emeralds, through any method doesn't matter, but the hero path is probable. Black Doom collects them off him and reveals his plan, Shadow hunts him down and sees the message Gerald originally left for him, warning him of Black Dooms intent...
Shadow destroys Black Doom, smashes the Black Comet with the Eclipse Cannon (damages not destroyed in Sonic Adventure 2, if you play the Dark side there you discover that it was never programmed to work in the first place, maybe Sonic did no damage to it at all?????)
Afterwards Shadow stops to think on the Ark, having recovered a photograph of Gerald and Maria. He says his goodbyes and turns to leave, finally happy that he knows who he is and where he came from. know he knows the truth he puts his past behind him and leaves...
I'd like to think that he commits suicide... No really, his final words "Goodbye Shadow the Hedgehog." His stories over, as he states in several of his stories he should never have been created, and he's done the purpose he was created for. All of them... He's activated the Ark's crash course to earth... Collected the Chaos Emeralds... Destroyed Black Doom... Saved the Earth for Maria...
He's finished, let him jump out of an airlock and the next Sonic game move on...
This stoy did do a lot, but it did it ALL to Shadow and not to anyone else...
It didnt give any full answers, but it gave important bits... Everything above is supposition, but it works... Needleslly convoluted, yes, but it works
Also, the reason GUN seems a lot more open than in SA2 is because they have CAUSE to be... I mean, the world IS being invaded and their down there, on the ground fighting to protect it...
IN SA2 the world wasnt in danger untill near the end, it was just them hunting down a Chaos Emerald thief, there was no need for them to show temselves, just deploy a few robots. Here, the earth is being invaded so they do... it all works out fine...
Also, spot the Sonic X refence, besides the VA actors, GUNS role in the game, the way the Egg Dealer attacks reminds me of the spinning thing in Sonic X
I'm finding it ironic that this game is sort of Sonic Adventure 2 1/2, considering Archie did the Sonic Adventure 2.5 story that also featured aliens bent on destruction. That story sucked, and so does this games story. Any more comparisons?
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I'd like to think that he commits suicide...
Hah, you wish. Apparently Shadow is the second most popular character next to Sonic. Do you think they're just going to get rid of him if he brings home the bacon?
SEGA failed to give us a satisfactory ending. I'm all for open endings, but with Shadow we're left wondering what the hell "Goodbye shadow the hedgehog" means. Is he going to slit his wrists, apply for a new name or bang his head on the fridge and do the amnesia schtick all over again?
One other thing I wonder about - the artificial chaos robots(?)... how did the scientists aboard the Ark obtain the data of Chaos in the first place? They would've had to summon him, which wouldn't have gone down well as we saw in SA. The humans couldn't take down Chaos even in his imperfect form.
Anyway, Chaos was sealed inside the Master Emerlad... the Master Emerald that was back on Angel Island, on Sonics home planet of ______. The ruins in Sonic Adventure - if we are to believe Sonic X - are part of Sonics world. And even if you don't believe the Sonic X explanation and that the games always took place on Earth, the Master Emerald was on Angel Island and the guardian of it wouldn't have let some nerds from a space colony touch it.
Dont believe Sonic X, different continuity entirely... It's more than possible Gerald could of seen the ruins in Sonic Adventure, examined some Chao and thought "Wow, wouldnt it be great if I could make water sentient?"
So he makes a couple of machines capable of manipulating water and hey presto... Instant destruction when the water things decide; "Lets kill people."
Seriously. Leave Sonic X out of the equation. Even ignoring the fact that Gerald outright says that he's created Shadow's memories from scratch, there's way too much OMGWTF?!?!?! about the Chaos Emeralds and such. Just leave alone :p
I like your overview Swift, but I'm still EXCEPTIONALLY begrudging anyone would be stupid enough to entertain the motion that Maria and Shadow didn't know eachother, again, the conversation in SA2 regarding that was while Rouge thought Biolizard was Shadow and was screwing with Shads head. People do this alot, it's nothing to be considered and start fan-theory'ing about.
Now, my take on the main game versus the last chapter:
Spoilers (Select To Read): Going back a few pages I notice someone tried to pick the canon ending of the 10 preluding to the Final Chapter.
Thing is, elements from all endings seem to appear, but it's hard to decipher anything as Sega truly skewered the dark/hero missions in a really bizarre way, the easiest way to notice this is that the ruins from Glyphic Canyon are activated and turned into the floating ruins from Neutral Level 4. Problem is you need to Dark Mission level 2 to make the ruins float... so how does that compute when they fly in Neutral 2 which assumes you're just getting Emeralds.
But let's put all the elements from around the endings and find places for them:
Chaotix doing data retrieval implies that Mad Matrix happened, and that Vector made it to the Computer Room as noted in the Hero ending of the Semi-Hero storyline (which is my favourite, as it actually has some storyline!), however as noted before, this is minorly taken back by Shadow's SHOCK at Black Doom revealing Shadow to be created with his help, meaning his talk with Crazy GUN Commander (Duh! I'm going to get revenge for GUN killing everyone by joining them!) was unlikely to have happened.
Speaking of Crazy GUN Commander, if he and Prez are chillin' in a bunker, that means Dark-Dark ending would have happened to chase El President out of his Not!White House, go figure. Also, PSX's quote means that Eggy told Shadsie that he was an android, which is the neutral path (ya know, Shads is worse than Knuckles. If he asked "Why can't I shoot rockets from my hands" Eggman would have been like "....you're...out of ammo..." "Oh, ok! ^^ I mean... ANGST!")
Incidentally, as nothing happens in the Hero story, beyond Shadow having flashbacks (why does he steal the emerald in the VERY GOOD HERO story, but leaves it in the "Sort of Hero" story?) and yet it does fit in more than any other story, especially as it does turn out Shadow is the original SA2 Shadow.
Semi-Dark is about the only storyline which doesn't really fit in to the final one. I suppose we're not supposed to think about it too much.
Or looking on a positive mind, I assume it's symbolic of the final message of the game, it doesn't truly matter WHO I AM it only matters what he does. Of course it'd be nice what we're supposed to credit and discredit for the Last Story, but that's not as Vortex says "FRIKKIN DEEP! It's not supposed to make sense, it's DEEP! Damn it Craig, you and I were never supposed to understand anything because it's DEEP! It goes above our shallow heads!"*
It's a shame though, Sonic Team had the ability to do something really interesting with Shadow and instead they just decided to Retcon his origin, SA2 was riddled with plothole problems, but Shadow being created to find the key to immortality in order to save Maria was one of the very very few plotpoints which made total sense. Now it's been retcon-screwed and without even a passing mention of Biolizard.
I suppose I can add "writers like screwing with all the interesting aspects of the character" to the many MANY similarities Shadow has with Venom :3
* Vortex quote heavily editted to resemble English, as I don't have the original quote at hand, it was originally referring to Kingdom Hearts and the fact that it's the door to darkness, but light comes out and kills Ansem.
Perhaps I'm harsh, I dunno. I'm open minded and I didn't HATE the game, I just feel apathetic about it all, they didn't really tell us anything we either didn't already know or didn't care about. I mean I've been heavily discussing SA2 and Shadow for 3 years or so now and never once has anyone questioned HOW Gerald built Shadow, and the WHY was already taken care of. So who gives a crap about Black Doom, in the retcon sense of things?
See, the problem Craig is that you WANT to find problems with the story....
Spoilers (Select To Read): There's noting that contradicts Sonic Adventure 2. It told it's story. Shadow might not remember it, but we do. This game just gave us new information on Shadow. Just take all the info you knew in SA2 and add to it the fact the Gerald, stymied with creating the ULF sought out the help of Black Doom. Then, being a good man at the time, set up some fail safes to protect the planet in the form of the Eclipse Cannon. Like Shadow, it was made to save the Earth, and was only perverted upon Gerald's decent into madness.
there's no retcon with the Biolizard. It was just a failed prototype version of Project Shadow. Whether it was designed in part by Black Doom or not is inconsequential.
The GUN Commander blamed Shadow for the death abroad the Arc, not GUN. He knew Shadow's past, and thought he was EVIL. Then, during the botched clean up, he probably assumed that GUN was just doing their job to protect the Ark from the ULF. Furthermore, he may well have been raised by GUN, since his parents had be killed, thus indoctrinated by military propaganda. Goning further, since Shadow has memories of being Maria's only friend, then it's possible that Maria ignored the young commander after Shadow was born. That would make the lonely commander insanely jealous of Shadow to begin with, and highly suspicious.
Lastly, I see no problem with Sonic Battle. Emeral was just another project of Gerald. Also, Gerald's portrayal is very much in sync with his character in "Final Story." Yes, Shadow's angsty again, but not nearly as bad as before. And anyway, the situation is something he feels passionate about. In fact, he should feel even more impassioned after the events of "Shadow the Hedgehog" since it's the second time he nearly destroyed the planet. He didn't was Emeral to do the same. (Anyway, Amy and Tails also reverted a bit after Sonic Adventure 1's conclusion as well. It happens with these stock characters.)
See, the problem Craig is that you WANT to find problems with the story....
Since when have I had the pretence that I didn't? Half the reason I buy games, watch movies and read books is to hate them and rant about them on the internet :p
Shadow was my feast, and I shall enjoy it!
In spirit of such, rebuttal:
Spoilers (Select To Read): I'm not one of the ARGH! IT KILLED SA2 crowd, though those are all over the place, you have to admit they rewrote Maria's death and ruined it though. I'm sure there are fan-faps to restore Prison Island from being blown up and the Eclipse Cannon working again, I humbly ignored both disregards and moved on.
And that was my problem with it, it didn't add anything which was otherwise unneeded. The promo and hype of this game promised answers to the many questions we had about Shadow, just as Heroes promised Metal, both delivered without giving us anything to sink our teeth into.
I smiled when we got our explination as to why the Eclipse Cannon is there, it preserves Battle Good!Gerald without him seeming a total hypocrite (if he hates weapons so much, why does he own a gun collection ;p)
When I mentioned Biolizard I was just disappointed he wasn't mentioned in Shadow. It didn't take anything away from the experience, but the fact that they gave Doom Biolizard's scream means that they did remember it, just didn't bother to comment, it would have been a nice touch but it's not missed.
I know about GUN commanders official story. I just outright ignore it because it's stupid to the point I wish I could use a word beggining in R. After SA2 EVERYONE should know from Gerald's message and the Shadow Conspiracy that GUN was behind the masacre. Crazy GUN Commander has to be exceptionally thick headed to believe Shadow did it after that. Your fan-theory works, but the fact of the matter is Sega implimented a character who was in every position to know the truth and had him ignore/not know it without giving us a reason why. Hell, it took me 6 playthroughs to get why he was so angsty in the first place.
I also see no problem with Sonic Battle, in terms of Gerald, just in Shadow's character being completely opposite of what it will be when Battle happens after this. See Battle can't have happened before or after Heroes due to Shadow's memory and such. So it's after Shadow, having an ending where he rejects his entire past doesn't bode well when (canon wise) his next appearance has him dwelling on his past to the point of obsession.
Really, none of the things you picked out were huge issues and two of them were total mis-understandings of what I was saying.
My issue with Shadow The Hedgehog's storyline is that it could have all been dealt with in the ending of Heroes with Eggman saying "I picked you up with my robot", we already HAD a reason why Shadow was created and it was satisfactory, it didn't require us unblowing up Prison Isle, repairing the Eclipse Cannon and tweaking Maria's Death so she's in Sonic X pose ;p
The game was a nice idea and I would have enjoyed it more if it dwelled more on Shadow's character during his life rather than before it, and had some form of SA1 styled character interaction which lead him to his final revelation rather than Deus Ex Machina Gerald Recording Mark 2.
I doubt I'm being unreasonable with that wish, instead Shadow barely interacts with anyone and it seems like all of the character exploration that went on during monologues can only be taken in a "what if" sense, like the 10 endings are all horrible "this would happen, but thankfully it didn't" scenarios before the final chapter. I did my best to chip-chop everything together in my above post and hope that those events did take place, overwise my brain will overheat from confusia 😀
So, end of story, I'm not overly bothered about the continuity issues or the plot or what the game gave us, I'm just annoyed that the game was packaged with a huge "SHADOW'S CHARACTER BUILDING EXCERCISE" and as he interacts with no one sans Eggman and Doom, the majority of the in-game stuff is "what if" and the ending leaves him the same as always, just less obsessed with the past (which is edit-undid for Battle), I left the game with nothing. I never cared about the plot behind Project Shadow, that was already sorted. I wanted something about that pile of angst to latch onto and love as I have done with so many over Sonic characters. Sonic Team made him as flat as a diet coke left open next to the radiator for a week. I get disappointed.
Life goes on *burns Shadow and hugs Blaze, for impressing me against expectations*
Edit from here:
Spoilers (Select To Read): Believe it or not, I do enjoy this game, the gameplay is unobtrusive to me, I didn't have to kill myself through it like Heroes, had I not have had Rush (both band and game) to occupy me I would have done this on the weekend I got it. I've even been doing some mild defending of it when it comes to some nitpicks I'm finding on LJ, forums and in my e-mail.
One person, for example, ranted about how Crazy GUN Commander was on the ARK in the first place as Maria was supposed to be the only child, why she befriended Shadow, only there because she was going to die etc etc. I just shrug and say researchers may have had families onboard, sure it's a top secret satellite and it's compramising national security if some 10 year old snot presses his face to glass and sees the most secret projects... but family! You know. Family!
Of course that begs the question on why his family were killed and he wasn't. I mean everyone was ARRESTED, Maria was shot because she was shuttling off Shadow through the crazy un-airlocked "will kill everyone in the room" capsule of trapping hedgehogs. I can ignore this as unimportant plotpoint which I'd rather not see elaborated.
Trust me, if you think I'M nitpicking, wait until the people who LIKE Shadow as a character finish the game, the way these e-mails are coming, they'll be hitting full force in a week or two :3
I'm being nice, I enjoyed it comparatively speaking ^_^
We need a topic for spoilers.
All I can say is that what would you prefer, a crap game with a great story that has no plotholes or piss-ups whatsoever, or a good game with a storyline that's only messed up if you examine it closely?
You'll enjoy it more if you don't think about it, which is true of an awful lot of things in life.
These people are employed to make games, not stories. Shadow the Hedgehog is probably the closest thing to an RPG game Sonic Team has made yet, thanks to all the different endings and paths. So the story's freaked out. Did that mean you had less fun shooting up GUN and slicing up aliens?
No, Sonic Battle is not an RPG. It is completely linear.
All I can say is that what would you prefer, a crap game with a great story that has no plotholes or piss-ups whatsoever, or a good game with a storyline that's only messed up if you examine it closely?
A crap game with a great story. I'd insult great stories by adding "Why do you think Kingdom Hearts and Final Fantasy sold so well", but I have enough taste not to.
To me, games are like movies. I watch them and extract enjoyment from them, wether I do this via MST3K'ing it, ranting about it like an insane forum warrior or actually noticing something insightful, original or interesting with the plot which I can enjoy, watch again and then discuss with friends; either way I get my money's worth and enough finger fuel to light a thousand topics 😀
All I can say is that what would you prefer, a crap game with a great story that has no plotholes or piss-ups whatsoever, or a good game with a storyline that's only messed up if you examine it closely?
A balance. Which I assure you, is possible and has been pulled of by countless many games and series before. Yet with this, we get a sub-par game with a messed up story.
Sad, really.
It's not the plot details and niggles that i extract, it's the ideas... I loved SA, SA2 and Shadow because they had great ideas... Heroes had the idea that "Teamwork is better than going solo" which was a bit... .... ... Well, it was bad...
Anyway, Im considering working on my overviwer, cleaning it up, editng it and making a full editoriall.... It'll be usefull to have the entire thing in writing on the site, it has to go down somewhere...
Anyway, Never Turn Back, best Crush 40 song since I Am... 
Bickering and whatnot aside, I just want to say that...
Spoilers (Select To Read): Smacking GUN soliders as Maria is far more amusing than it should be.
www.lighthead.net/misc/images/licky.jpg
www.lighthead.net/misc/images/stabby.jpg
.... >.>
I got a little bored...
There should have been a giant shadow android boss. Then it could've made that impression everytime you hit it.
Is it just me, or were the bosses a bit more of a challenge in this game? I could've sworn that in the Egg Breaker fight after Mad Matrix, there was hardly a moment where Eggy would stop going on the offensive (except when you were on the floating platforms), and that's something I liked.
Boss fights seemed easier to me. Once you got a hold of a gun, you could just fire away and kill the sunnavagun, no matter how big they are.
They also seem more annoying. I swear I can here "You know what they say: The more the merrier!" every night in my nightmares...
Oh, Crazy... Sounds like 2 player co-op makes the game easier.
Is that true?
I heard that too. The two player should have had more characters intead of a repaint Shadow also an online mode. Man it would have been cool if this had online mode to see who complete the mission first or to gang up on a boss.
BWT fro those of you who "love" Vector voice.
>_<
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Oh, Crazy... Sounds like 2 player co-op makes the game easier.
Is that true?
Mmm... yeah, I suppose so. It's hard to say since we didn't spend too much time on it, and it's fairly easy to lose sight of the second character because the camera doesn't follow them (but you can generally bring them back by pausing) but they can attack enemies without fear of dying(sometimes, it seems, the secondary character's attacks are far stronger, but I can't confirm this) and pick up rings for Shadow, so it can be quite useful.
The co-op is limited in terms of the secondary character's actions, so it's still kinda like Tails in the early games. They can't pick up weapons, Tails can't fly, and Rouge and Knuckles can't glide (but they seem to have greatly extended jumps). Oddly enough, Knuckles seems to have a faster top speed than Shadow. o_O
Even though it's limited, it is kinda fun.
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They also seem more annoying. I swear I can here "You know what they say: The more the merrier!" every night in my nightmares...
You know, was it just my copy of the game, or did Eggman say that repeatedly alot of the time during that one boss battle? Anyways, how did you guys unlock the 2-Player co-op mode? I didn't even know there was one. 
Yeah, he said it whenever he did the attack where he shoots out multiple spheres at you. Got incredibly annoying seeing as that was like the attack he abused most in that fight. Thankfully, Diabalon's (or whatever it's called) "Stand still you devil!" wasn't near as annoying, even if it was overused as much as Eggy's line.
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Anyways, how did you guys unlock the 2-Player co-op mode? I didn't even know there was one.
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Like old games all you have to do is plug in a second controller and then you can control the character next to Shadow.
BTW there something I been wondering is there anyway to unlock the Shadow bike riding cinema from the intro in Story mode?
It's very likely you can't. It was probably made just for the intro, like much of that.
Well there are 300+ ways to finish the game and each path has different versions of the cinemas. Maybe the others cinemas from intro could be there you know 
.
Same movies, just in a different order...
Chances are, if you've done all 10 stories you've seen and heard 90% of everything
Wrong. The dialogue is different depending on your actions. For example in Westopolis if you do the Dark mission the scene where the President appears his secretary mention that Westopolis fell and if you do the Hero mission she says the city was saved. So no they are not the same cinemas and yes there could be a really small chance that cinemas from the intro(besides the one from Eggman ordering his troops, Shadow being transported into space and the Ark firing) could be there. Remember there 326 Library chapter in the game and not everyone has unlocked them all.
Here the list of chapter that people have already unlocked so far:
www.gamefaqs.com/console/...26672.html
Do hero in Westopolis and you get the hero westopolis video, do villain in Sky Troops and you get te evil in sky troops video...
Once you've done every mission in every level in story move, you've seen all the movies, including all the chanegs in text. The only new thing you can unlock is a name for the library movie collection...
And, besides, that's just little dialogue edits... No new movies, no desroyed ones, just more of the same...
So if you want to ensure you see EVERYTHING, complete all the branching paths in Story Mode. The grey lines that connect stages fill in white once completed.
What an odd way for a game to be laid out... I'm getting my copy this weekend!! O_O
But GI hasn't given it a review, so I dunno much about it.
EDIT: Ha! I got my copy today (Dec 1)!! Quite fun it is!
So, yeah, I finally managed to check out Shadow, and... well, it's really a mixed bag. Most of it's pretty much as bad as stated, but yet I'm still having some fun out of it.
A run down of my thoughts so far:
In conclusion, a real love/hate situation. I've still got 10 endings to go, though, so I'll keep playing until Sunday. I just seriously wonder if my opinions really going to change before then. Right now, if I had to rate it, it'd be anywhere from 4-6, but no higher. Probably no lower, either, consdering that it's vaguely entertaining.
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Voice Acting is pretty bad. I mean, dear God, who actually made Vector sound like THAT? I'd heard that his voice was off well back in the Sonic X dub, but I had no idea it was THIS bad. Shadow sounds disinterested, Charmy is annoying, the G.U.N. soldiers never shut up, the G.U.N. Commander doesn't exactly sound like I thought he would (although he's okay)... Tails is good, though, as are Eggman and Black Doom. They, frankly, should've stuck with Drummond for Sonic, but Griffith is okay.
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You should rent the PS2 version. Shadow japanese VA sounds more interested and has an more evil laughter than his english one. Also Rouge sound sexy instead of sounding like an old woman,Vector doesn't sounds like he has nasal problems,Cream sound sounds cute when she calls Shadow "Shadow-san" 
, Tails reminds me of Ling-Ling from Comedy Central's Drawn Together 
seriously he does, Charmy is less annoying and the rest they sound okay. Althought Black Doom laughter sound forced.
Good post, Shadow Hog - fair comments.
"Characters won't shut up. At least you can go Neutral, but I think Shadow winds up talking then... then again, that might just be the hint points."
I went back to Heroes after playing Shadow (to see if Heroes was really as bad as I remembered), and the amount of talking in Heroes seems like nothing in comparison. As a side note, I found that not only was I better at playing Heroes after my Shadow experience, but I also enjoyed it a lot more. Says a lot about Shadow.
"Am I the only one getting tired of loops?"
Definitely not. Again, I found the loops in Heroes to be better to watch (because as you said, you don't play those parts, you watch them. But they were pretty cool in the city stages) upon going back. But what I mainly hate about loops nowadays is the spastic way the camera moves out and.. I dunno, just the whole way the characters run around them looks and feels glitchy. If the loops are still out of our control these days, they should at least look smooth.
"The camera is definitely still bad."
The thing I hate most about Shadow's camera is that it's no longer controlled by the L and R triggers, but rather the second stick (at least on the Xbox version this is how it is, don't know about the other consoles). I don't like having to take my thumb off the other buttons to rotate the camera. Especially as I most often need to be able to shoot or jump ASAP thanks to hordes of offscreen enemies that move faster than the camera (which is slow as heck). And what do the triggers do now? L = nothing, R = a useless strafe mode. BAH!
"They should've kept in the first-person camera, too."
1st-person cam is there (loved it in SA1, was sad it didn't exist in SA2, welcomed its return in Heroes though for some reason it felt off).. but in Shadow, it sucks. You can't look upwards, which actually tends to be the direction I find myself wanting to be looking in this game.
"The swords prove to be highly useless"
And you need to collect a bunch of them in order to have them for more than a minute, as well.
"Is it just me, or is the homing attack more stilted than ever? I mean, I push forward, implying "the direction of what I want to target (ie: nothing) is this way", but it takes that as "okay, I'll aim to this badguy to your side for you", slowing me down instead of letting me catch up to, say, that ship in Lethal Highway (which I was unable to kill, irritatingly; oh, and you can't tell where the ship is often-times, too, and you can never tell how much health it has)."
Gargh, yes!! I'm tired of jumping over a bunch of larvae/Doom spawn and trying to speed up to hurry past and not be hit by anything, but instead being sucked towards one of the little buggers. And then I need to take out more of them in order to land safely and go on my way again.
"I just seriously wonder if my opinions really going to change before then."
Probably won't. I personally need three more endings (bar the last story one) and the only improvement in feelings towards the game I've experienced stem directly from the improvment of my own skills (allowing me to get things done quicker and more efficiently, resulting in fewer things making me angry 
).
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You should rent the PS2 version.
Buy me a PS2 and I'll consdier it.
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The thing I hate most about Shadow's camera is that it's no longer controlled by the L and R triggers, but rather the second stick (at least on the Xbox version this is how it is, don't know about the other consoles).
It's the same in the GameCube version. Not a huge issue for me; I'm kind of used to it from Nintendo's recent GameCube games which have a similar setup.
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1st-person cam is there (loved it in SA1, was sad it didn't exist in SA2, welcomed its return in Heroes though for some reason it felt off).. but in Shadow, it sucks. You can't look upwards, which actually tends to be the direction I find myself wanting to be looking in this game.
Ditto, which really makes me wonder if that can even be qualified to be a "first-person camera"; especially considering that it moves back into third-person the instant you start moving again.
Other than that, I'm beginning to wonder... you ever consider how weird it is that the loops show up where they do? I mean, really. Who in their right mind would design roads with loops in them? Have they even tried to navigate loops in a car (rather, a racing game of some sort that just happens to have loops)? It's freakin' hard! I'm thinking that maybe they should cut down on the loop usage; after all, Sonic 1 had, like, two zones that used loops, and it was none the worse for it.
22 Days until I play Shadow anyways...
About loops. I agree that they should either:
A) More interactive based on your speed or B) Toned down.
I got an idea using Emerald Hill Style Corkscrews. When you enter one it turns into a Sonic 2 style special stage where forward momentum is fixed but you can more left and right. and if you run into say a spikey ball you fall off.
You know what would be fun with loops? If the camera kept following you as if it was a normal stretch of ground, like that loop in Act 1 of Palmtree Panic, and the first half of the giant "square" loop in Seaside Hill. Imagine the nausea!
Kinda like Sonic CD's Palmtree loops, huh? I remember Vec saying something similar, only taking it further by giving you something to do while traversing the loop like dodging obstacles in your path. "More gameplay, less scripted events!" he yelled, as he galloped into the night atop his majestic white stallion.
Do you think the camera should follow you like in Sonic R's loops? You had a little liberty in movement there.. but if you weren't fast enough you could get stuck in the loop. o.o''
Ah, in that case I agree with the almighty Vec. (TV has given me the attention span of a little bwee. :D)
EDIT: Oops, Erika snuck a post in there.
Anyway, Cosmic Fall is one of the WORST stage designs I've seen in a LONG time from this franchise. The whole "falling" thing would be a little less disconcerting if you could actually tell where you're to go next. Actually, that's another problem with the camera - on moving platforms, it just flat-out refuses to move, even at the top of its path; meaning that, often times, you've no freakin' clue where you're supposed to go.
So far, I'm thinking this is actually a step down from Heroes, which I at least liked to an extent. 4/11 endings, now, almost ready for 5, but I want to get the Hero ending out of the way, and I have to Triangle Jump VERY far to get that. Which would be okay, if Triangle Jump was reliable, and it isn't. Often times I'll have hung on for a split-second and it'll drop me off the wall, without any warning. Awful.
Awww... I like Cosmic Fall... One of the most original levels in the game... Despite Vectors annoying voice...
The trick is NEVER to touch the camera, not at all... It'll show you what you need to get through the level (not to get the keys, sadly) but by touching the camera it offsets it and it'll be screwed up for the next bit untill you get to solid ground again...
Seriously, the camera for Shadow is fine for moving around, by if you want to look around try playing Halo or a FPS... 
Also, as for triangle jumping, It lets you hang there for a second or so... You can either jump, or hang there, it's the same as Heroes... It's stepped up in that you can move while hanging there, but still only for a second or so
The most annoying thing I found was that the last jump is always the weakest, so it's safer and more reliable to, when you reach the end, to run off the edge and drop down than to jump and risk not making it...
It's not hard, seriouslly. It doesnt take THAT much to stop yourself from sticking there for over a second, if there's something in the way just jump straigh opposite you then back...
But what's happening to Shadow Hog is that the second he hits the wall (and Shadow goes into the 'grip' pose), he falls off again. This happens to me on occasion, there's no explanation for it, and has nothing to do with your wall jumping skills.
Great loop-/-camera ideas, you guys! All of them. I wonder why I forgot about the way the camera follows you in Sonic R (which was quite good).
Forget Cosmic Fall - I dislike every fall you take in this game. Shadow must have a small antigravity device lodged in his chest - he falls so damn slow! I just want to get down there and continue onwards. Argh!!
I'll add another one to the unreliable Triangle Jump. I do my best to avoid doing so. I almost snapped the disc when my progress on The Doom DARK mission was ended because I had to triangle jump back from killing a beetle.
