Sonic Advance 1:
Tries too much to be like the clasic games, it plays and feels like a museum. Even the colour scheme is a bit grim and boring with only the Egg rocket ship really looking spectacular. Although there are some nice ideas in there, nothing is new and nothing works perfectly. Too slow and to many cheap hits, nice try but nothing special. Plus, the special zone is just, urghhh.
This is about as average as a Sonic game gets, i'd give it 6/10

Sonic Advance 2:
They corrected all of the problems with the last one but went tooo far, wheras Advance 1 was to slow this is too fast, and although it's a nice diversion to blister through giant zones at Sonic speed, there's NO replay value. Colour wise it's much brighter and more interesting, but still nothign special. The bosses were a nice idea but largely dont work, it'd be nice if you were running for a few but for all of them? Plus Im not a cream fan so negatve points for that
On the good side the R moves are nice and the music is bright and slightly more original, but nothing that you'll remmember. Good special zones, but again a bit difficult. An improvement game but creates its own problems compared to the first.
7/10

Sonic Advance 3:
The best 2D game since Sonic 3 in my opinion, large and detailed levels that allow you to go fast OR slow. You can play it however you like and there's tonnes of diversity. Graphics wise it's the best with VERy animate characters, tonnes of variety in the robots AND the levels, evocative and stylish. It combines the class of the first game with the adventure of the second perfectly.

It's just a shame that the G-mel (sp?) plot is wasted and it's a prime example of the over use of Chaos Control.
Also, the crush detector is a bit iffy, where you can be crushed by a crate moving AWAY from you???
People might complain that Amy's rubbish, but she's optional. There's so much variety that what you don't like you can largely ignore, and experimenting with various combinations is rather fun.
The gem of the collection, is Sonic Advance 1 had been like this and the other 2 were improvements then we'd be looking at something REALLY special right now.
9/10

Sonic Advance 1 was really like a 'classic' Sonic game. Nothing new or interesting, and no replay value, and a bit slow, but still, not a screw-up.

6/10

Sonic Advance 2 SUCKED. It was just like Sonic Advance 1, only to get into Special Stages you needed to get seven hidde rings, and to get the rings you had to take a specific route. And the end of level bosses running was a horrible idea. If you got hit you'd lose all your rings and then they ran out half-way through. Nice ideas, but badly implemented.

Not to mention the baddies that know EXACTLY when to fire, the emeralds not being shared, and the spikes placed in nasty places just as you're coming out of a loop make this a very unfair game.

Easy enough to finish, horribly frustrating to complete.

3/10

And thank god there was a third, because Sonic Advance 2 would be a lousy end to the Advance series. The Team play made it incredibly fun and there was great replay value.

The Chao were tough to collect sometimes, but once you'd found one, it was remembered, and you got to share Emeralds as well.

They dumped the Running Boss idea, but kept up the Rescuing Team-mates idea, which was cute. And the between-levels rests were a nice idea too.

A much better effort, although there's still improvements to be made.

8/10

for me:

Sonic Advance 1: nice simple nostalgic game. not very original and not very fast (it seems dead slow after you've played Sonic Advance 2). a nice feeling of the classics.

Sonic Advance 2: the answer for anybody who thought the Sonic franchise was becoming slow. this game was nothin' but speed. it easily became the fastest Sonic game to date, but while it was a perfect game to give a gamer a nice adrenaline rush, that was both it's gift and curse. the game was mostly a "hold right and win" game. and many didn't like it's chase type boss system. though a good amount of obstacles and the R tricks added some more taste, they weren't enough to make this game feel better to Sonic purists. the only form of replay value was the game's speed. a great game that will easily become a classic (it was especially hot in the UK), but lacking in many areas for a Sonic game.

Sonic Advance 3: the game that took the best features of both Advance 1&2 and added more to the mix. it took Advance 1's high level of puzzles and obsacles and Advance 2's superior speed and intensity and merged them with even more nostalgia and a nice team system that many liked better than Heroes' (btw, Naka came up with the team system for Adv3 himself). the levels felt retro in their own right, but were more original than Sonic Advance 1's. stationary bosses made a comeback in this game as they were rather creative (ex:the Twinkle Snow and Cyber Track bosses). a nearly perfect game if SEGA had added a bit more to the team system, fixed the rather minor bugs (like getting crushed by a block next to you) and of course, the two thing that the entire Advance series lacked: a stroyline and a great amount of levels. sure the added 3rd act was a good idea (and added a very nice nostalgic taste), but the acts should have looked more unique from eachother and that wasn't enough to save the game from being on the short side.

Overall: i enjoyed the Advance series. they were better than the classics in some ways though short and easy. that's why i wouldn't be upset if Rush turns out to be very Sonic Advance-like as Naka wanted it to be (maybe not strongly). but i'm still glad to here that it's more retro than Advance. someone said that they heard somewhere that Rush will be less confusing than the Advance series. i don't understand how it was confusing, but it's good to know since that may mean that they are really going for the classic style.

Quote:

---

(btw, Naka came up with the team system for Adv3 himself)

---

Further proof that Naka has more sense over what he's doing than Iizuka. Shame he's not directed any games lately, AFAIK, it'd be nice to see how HE'D handle the Sonic liscense if HE had to come up with all the ideas.

I don't really like the Advance series. The first one was pretty good. I don't remember the second one, but the third one SUCKS. I really have no idea why people like it so much. There's barely anything to do, you can press and hold one of a the direction keys without doing anything until you finish the level. It tries to be as speedy and flowing like the original games, and fails.

Neon, i REALLY think you're remembering the second one and it's the third one you forgot...

I'm starting to feel like I'm the only one who liked the the 2nd advance game. I think the best thing SAdv2 had going for it was that you needed to get Emeralds as every character to see the true ending (and I really liked the Special Stages in this one as they were far easier than the norm). Sadv2 also has a slightly better Chao Garden than the first (Cream's mini-game = bliss, plus I was actually able to get my Chao to swim and fly around). The main drawback of SAdv2 was the boss stages, which tanked. For that reason, the third game is my favorite overall, followed closely by 2, with 1 bringing up the rear (it was just too simple and too short).

They were all flat out bad games. The level design was poor, with many bottomless pits and enemies that came out of nowhere, each level played too similarly. There was no sense of progression at all. The levels were derivative and bland (both in terms of gameplay and visuals), the Music Plant and Toy Kingdom levels didn't really belong in a Sonic game, they didn't look like places that could exist in Sonic's world.

The characters played too similarly and there was little reason to play as Sonic.

The Special Stages were all awful, suffering from shoddy physics and depth perception and were too difficult to access in the first place.

The rolling bosses in the second game played terribly, they were nothing more than tests of endurance, every time you got hit you'd be sent to the back of the screen and have to wait for more rings to come by (if you hadn't already grabbed them all) to stand a chance.

The tag team system of Advance 3 was a good idea, but implemented in a way that didn't make sense and the secondary character would fall off of the screen 99% of the time.

The music was okay, but not to the same high standard maintained by the main Sonic games.

These 3 games don't even come close to matching the quality of any of the Mega Drive platformers or even Sonic & Tails 1 and 2 on Game Gear. That is completely unacceptable.

I didn't like the advance series much, it had some good ideas but they didn't seem too great to me. Im looking forward to sonic rush though.

Interesting wide berth of comments and thoughts on the series. Good to see everyone has a tilt on views.

Strangly, I've only played throught 1 and 2 properly at the moment, and I far prefer 2. But I agree that the Music Plant Zone seems out of place, I felt like I playing Zool, not the spiky hedgehog I thoughts I was controlling. The levels seem boring too, as they all merge into one for me.

Not a happy Camper. :">

Strange Question but could the GBA actually emulate the original games? Could it recreate the detailed graphics and game engines?

Do you think it would be wise to release the originals on the GBA, particulary 1-3? I know I'd think about buying them, as afterall, my GBA is a console bought predominantly to play games on trains, airplanes, and for other long periods of emptiness. I can't think of anythin preferable to playing Sonic 2 on a 14 hour flight, certainly after playing the Advance series for a few weeks...

It wouldnt make commercial sense, their available to modern gamers on the gamecube and you'd loose too much with the GBA's small screen...

Wouldnt work.

EDIT: I DO advise you try advance 3, it combines the faster levels with MUCH more variety in the gameplay.

Isn't the upcoming new Gameboy meant to be able to play GC discs? The whole idea seems a bit farfetched to me, but it Nintendo manages to get it to work, then more power to them.

Isn't the upcoming new Gameboy meant to be able to play GC discs?

The next Gameboy hasn't been announced (unless you count Micro as a new one, which you shouuldn't). The folks at IGN speculate that it's possible that the new Gameboy will play Gamecube games, but... well, someone else will have to tell you what can't be spelled without "ign," because I'm sick of hearing that one so I sure as heck ain't gonna say it.

They were all flat out bad games.

That's your opinion. Mine's different. I enjoyed Sonic Advance 3 quite a lot. Since enjoyment is the only standard by which I judge games, Sonic Advance 3 scores highly in my opinion.

Quote:

---

well, someone else will have to tell you what can't be spelled without "ign," because I'm sick of hearing that one so I sure as heck ain't gonna say it.

---

Okay.

Igneous. Because rocks are cool.

Quote:

---

That's your opinion.

---

REALLY?

Yes, really

Quote:

---

The level design was poor, with many bottomless pits

---

The idea is not to fall off the bottom of the screen, and it's not as if there were no bottomlss pits in OLD sonic game, Wing Fortress for example.

Quote:

---

and enemies that came out of nowhere, each level played too similarly.

---

Last act of the final level in Sonic Advance 3, there's nothing like it in ANY Sonic game... Plus I recomment to you Egg Rocket in the original advance where you spend the lkevel climbing the rocket and compare it to leaf Forest in Sonic Advance 2...

Quote:

---

There was no sense of progression at all.

---

Um, leave one level and enter another...
Theres just as much progression as there was in Sonic 1 and 2...

Quote:

---

The levels were derivative and bland (both in terms of gameplay and visuals),

---

The final level in Sonic Advance 3, compare that to the techno levels. Sunset Hills is gorgeius and Egg Rocket is the best looking thing in advance 1.

Quote:

---

the Music Plant and Toy Kingdom levels didn't really belong in a Sonic game,

---

They doont fit in with the Sonic Universe true, but that doesnt make them bad games in my book, just odd ones.

Quote:

---

The characters played too similarly and there was little reason to play as Sonic.

---

Not true in Sonic Advance 3, and there are more differences between them in Advance games than there were in Sonic 2 and 3, apparently reputed to be the best games in Sonic history, I dont remember it being a complaint then?

Quote:

---

The Special Stages were all awful, suffering from shoddy physics and depth perception and were too difficult to access in the first place.

---

Very true...

Quote:

---

The rolling bosses in the second game played terribly,

---

Marks down the second game not the whole series

Quote:

---

The tag team system of Advance 3 was a good idea, but implemented in a way that didn't make sense and the secondary character would fall off of the screen 99% of the time.

---

In Sonic 2 Tails fell of the screen just as much, but he was still nice to have along. They do help,

Quote:

---

The music was okay, but not to the same high standard maintained by the main Sonic games.

---

On average, yes...

Quote:

---

These 3 games don't even come close to matching the quality of any of the Mega Drive platformers or even Sonic & Tails 1 and 2 on Game Gear. That is completely unacceptable.

---

Although I'd rate them beneath the mega drive games or Sonic CD, I'd rate them above ANY Game Gear game I've ever played, I've hated all of them.
But, thats just my opinion

well than i guess alot of you will LOVE Rush because even if you stop dead in you tracks, you can boost up to maximum speed will a press of a button.

and i must say that some of your reasons of disliking the Advance series aren't very good. tons bottomless pits? that's Sonic 101! badniks stopping you dead in your tracks? that's Sonic 101! characters playing similar? that is SO Sonic 101 (Tails and Knux weren't much different from Sonic in the old games)! partner falling off cliffs 24/7? that's Sonic 101.....plus, the AI in SAdv3 was MUCH better than the old games in many areas. at least your partner attacked ppl on their own.

Quote:

---

tons bottomless pits? that's Sonic 101!

---

It is if you play the 3D ones, but you may have noticed we're not too fond of them. Sonic CD has none such things and it's considered one of the best in the series. Go fig.

Quote:

---

badniks stopping you dead in your tracks? that's Sonic 101!

---

Uh, no it isn't. Usually when you find enemies you're moving at a slow enough pace that you can take them on. NOT hurtling forward at 100 MPH.

Quote:

---

characters playing similar? that is SO Sonic 101 (Tails and Knux weren't much different from Sonic in the old games)!

---

Uh, yes they were. They had unique skills that could get them to new areas. Sonic may have had the least features in that aspect, but he also was the only one with the ability to use the shields properly, as well as the main story, which certainly propelled him forward among the three.

Quote:

---

partner falling off cliffs 24/7? that's Sonic 101

---

Not... really. In the old games Tails did a somewhat better job of keeping up with you. Prolly was because you slowed down here and there around enemies and/or platforming segments, and it definitely was usually because of ways they found to use the environment to slow you down, not a poorly-placed pit or enemy.

No offense, but you better rethink "Sonic 101" before you get to teaching it this school year.

Sonic 101 sounds like a crappy game, and just as I thought the series was about to have a creative revival with Sonic 97.

Can someone explain what this whole 101 busines sis please?

College classes, I think.

Either that or something along the lines of "the basics".

you mean to tell me that you think the Advance series had more pits than the old games*points to levels like hill top*? you're saying that you get stopped dead in your tracks more often in the Advance series?

and have you played Sonic Advance 3? Tails and Knuckles were a lot more unique from Sonic than the old games. Tails and Knuckles could always reach places that Sonic couldn't. that's been seen many times in the old games and the Advance series...but look at this:

SONIC 3:

Sonic's basic abilities:
-run
-jump
-spin dash
-insta shield

Tails' basic abilities:
-run
-jump
-spin dash
-fly
-swim

Knuckles' basic abilities:
-run
-jump
-spin dash
-glide
-smash through walls

^^^in case you haven't noticed, they aren't very different. they basically have the same moves plus one that makes them a little more different then the other.

now look at this:
SONIC ADVANCE 1(i purposely put this one since it's the most basic out of the three):

Sonic's basic abilities:
-run
-jump
-spin dash
-air dash
-insta shield
-somersault
-rail grind

Tails' basic abilities:
-run
-jump
-spin dash
-fly
-swim
-tail swipe

Knuckles basic abilities:
-run
-jump
-spin dash
-glide
-punch
-breast stroke

^^^they don't have much of a difference as well. but at least there's more of a difference. it wasn't until SAdv3 that they became more unique.

and the partners AI in SAdv3 was arguably the better than the old games. here's what i think:

Old partner AI>New partner AI: in terms of sticking with you. SEGA gave the partners in SAdv3 a tad too much independence.

New Partner AI>Old partner AI: in terms of helpfulness. in the old games, Tails had almost no use as a partner unless you had someone controlling him. in Sonic Advance 3, when you get close enough to an enemy, your partner attacks plus tag actions.

partners falling down pits have been happening since Sonic 2. the partners were never really smart. they're just a bit more active in SAdv3 due to the increased AI that they tend to not watch where they're going. and even so, what does it matter?

and just like the old games, in the Advance series there's certain levels with lots of pits. nothing new to a veteran.

maybe it's just because you guys hate the new games that much.....no offense.

P.S: what are you talking about, VCP?

I think people are getting alittle too judgemental, the advance series was never suppose to be on the same level as the genesis series. The advance series were only handheld games so of course their not going to be as polished as the classics. I didn't care for any of them really but imo they are some of the best gba games to be released. Advance 3 is definitly the best of the bunch, but to compare it or any advance game to one of the genesis games isn't really fair.

The Robot King

Quote:

---

Can someone explain what this whole 101 busines sis please?

---

An analogy and then Lee being cute.

Shame on you all!! #^.^#

Yes. Hill Top didn't even have that many pits. Think about it. How many bottomless pits in Hill Top can you think of beyond that first one - which, might I add, you were usually informed of the path over well ahead of crossing it, mainly because you weren't throttling toward it very quickly like you always were in Advance 2. And, incidentally, for the earlier levels that's the case in most of the games. Green Hill and Emerald have pits, but in the former you have to REALLY go out of your way to leap in, and in the latter they're few, far between, small, and usually you'll never bump into them. Heck, most of Sonic 3 doesn't have pits, and when you DO find them, you're all the way in, like, Ice Cap, which is hardly an early level. Now, obviously, in some of the later levels, this changes, but get this: those are the LATER levels. They're supposed to be harder. Most of the Advance series likes to toss the bottomless pits in as early on as possible - it's not hard to fall into one in Route 99, for cryin' out loud, and that's the first level! I'll admit the first Advance was okay in that regard (I think most of the bottomless pits started in Ice Mountain, which is pretty far into the game) but it's gotten utterly ridiculous since, and I have the feeling Rush won't fix it.

Yes, very much so. You do have a tendency to get stopped in the earlier games, I'll admit, but get this: usually you're thrusted into a wall, or run up a large ramp, or something similar to slow you down. Running right into spikes and enemies does NOT happen anywhere near as frequently, and much less when you've just been sent upward by a spring (which I think is the most irritating part of the Advance series - it does THAT too often). In fact, I'd say the enemies are usually placed in places much easier to avoid them if need be, or to your advantage, than they are in the Advance games where they're frequently placed deliberately to put you to a stand-still or keep you from progressing.

Yes, I've played Sonic Advance 3. They're a lot more unique because Sonic's been completely and utterly dumbed-down. This is not a GOOD thing like you imply, it's a definite problem that needs addressing - and soon - before playing as Sonic becomes pointless. (And your list ignores Sonic's ability to use the sheilds as well as the fact he gets the main story, which, again, sets him well apart from the others. The laters ditched both of those, so there's no point in playing as him anymore other than laziness to the point where you won't hit up or down.)

And frankly, I've been more frustrated with my AI partner in Sonic Advance 3 than glad (s)he's there. As I recall, in Chaos Angel's boss, if I'm on one side of the wall and my partner's on the other side, and Eggman's on my partner's side, my partner almost NEVER gets Eggman for me. What's worse, if I drop my rings, my partner does NOTHING to try and grab them for me. What kind of help is that? At least in the old games they might jump up if the big group of rings I dropped is nearby, and they're a lot better at getting at Eggman.

So yeah, I know what I'm talking about. I'm very much a veteran, too, and I think you're just flat-out wrong.

ice Cap, Death egg, Scrap Brain, Wing Fortress, they ALL had bottomless puts....

I know that the bottom of the screen is a constant enemy in the advance games, but the answer is to climb higher and not fall of it.
There were loads of pits in the old games, just because they werent bottomless didn't matter.

Quote:

---

So yeah, I know what I'm talking about. I'm very much a veteran, too, and I think you're just flat-out wrong

---

Um, most of us are veterans here, or at least I am...
I've always found the second character to be next to no help at all, but the small ammount of help they can do is appreciated.
And from my experiences the new Ai is more intelligent, making it more independant which means it's less of a help at fighting but much better at grabbing rings...

And I was replaying the old games the other day and I was surprised how often I got caught out by flame throwers when I was trying to climb platforms or bad guys dropping down from above me unexpectedly.

Quote:

---

I think people are getting alittle too judgemental, the advance series was never suppose to be on the same level as the genesis series. The advance series were only handheld games so of course their not going to be as polished as the classics. I didn't care for any of them really but imo they are some of the best gba games to be released. Advance 3 is definitly the best of the bunch, but to compare it or any advance game to one of the genesis games isn't really fair.

---

I disagree entirely. Most of the Sonic Advance series' failings had little or nothing to do with the restrictions of the Game Boy Advance handheld console itself. Sadly a lot of video game companies seem to share this idea that handheld games don't have to be very good or have as much time or effort put into them as "big" games.

Quote:

---

I disagree entirely. Most of the Sonic Advance series' failings had little or nothing to do with the restrictions of the Game Boy Advance handheld console itself. Sadly a lot of video game companies seem to share this idea that handheld games don't have to be very good or have as much time or effort put into them as "big" games.

---

If you put levels like the old games on the advance screen you'd HAVE to scale them down, which would make Sonic a tiny dot on the screen or loose 3 quarters of the screen to see whats going on.
The old level designs wouldnt work, the way the game is put together in the first place is different, it's more compact.

The levels are more compact which is affecting your gaming which is making you not enjoy the experience, bu if they werent compact then you;d spend far to long jumping at platforms off screen.

I suspect the main reason people find enemies harder to dodge in the advance games is that theres less room to maneover around them, why? The screen size is smaller.

Does it help using a GameBoy Player?

Quote:

---

If you put levels like the old games on the advance screen you'd HAVE to scale them down, which would make Sonic a tiny dot on the screen or loose 3 quarters of the screen to see whats going on.
The old level designs wouldnt work, the way the game is put together in the first place is different, it's more compact.

The levels are more compact which is affecting your gaming which is making you not enjoy the experience, bu if they werent compact then you;d spend far to long jumping at platforms off screen.

I suspect the main reason people find enemies harder to dodge in the advance games is that theres less room to maneover around them, why? The screen size is smaller.

---

That is a problem, but it's not the sole problem. Mario World and Yoshi's Island work well enough on GBA.

Of course the level design should be made to accomodate the scale and screen size, but that doesn't mean that the level design has to be crap.

Although if the small screen was the sole cause of all of the series' problems then the answer should be to not make Sonic games on GBA at all.

^ Now the advance series is over so lets see how sonic rush tries to be a great handheld sonic game. Very crazy penguin I think the screen was a problem but not the sole problem, thats why the dual screen element of sonic rush seems pretty interesting to me. The Robot King

>Of course the level design should be made to accomodate the scale and screen size, but that doesn't mean that the level design has to be crap.

Twasnt crap, you just didn't like it.
Personally, I love some of the leves in Sonic Advance 3, and Egg Rocket act one is one of my all time favorite levels from any Sonic Game...

If the game style doesnt suit you, thats fine but personally I think the Advance games were a nice attempt to try and relive the old 2D glory days, but were let down by a few flaws mainly due to the fact that it had all been done before (there wasnt anything original), it took them 3 games to get it right and the smaller screen.

If Rush does play better with it's larger screen then thatll be telling, we'll just have to wait and see.

yeah, just wait for Rush. it should please all of you.

i'm not saying that you guys are stupid for thinking these things. it's just that, much like Swift, i don't see the problems that you see.

Rush should solve these areas of your problems:
-partner AI: no partners so it doesn't matter.

-unique-ness: Sonic and Blaze will play differently/go on different advenutres. that should be cool enough for those of you.

-small screen: two screens. bigger area. happy gamers.

-running into badniks and losing your speed: not a problem in this game. all you'll have to if that happens is press B and you'll dash back to the max speed: Rush mode. meaning that it'll be harder for 'niks to stop you dead in your tracks.

i'm not sure if it'll solve your pit problem though. but just wait and see. i'm praying that this game will please you guys enough.

for me, while i'm waiting, i'll play some more Sonic Advance. *plays Sonic Advance 1-3*

P.S: i still don't understand why you hate the partner AI in SAdv3 so much, SH. i mean, did you actually expect Tails to hit Eggy for you in Sonic 2? no. the partner's attack intelligence is heightened in Adv3, granted, but that doesn't mean that you can trust your partner 100%. THAT is DEFINATELY Sonic 101 (which means "Sonic basic". something that was known about Sonic since the classics).

Quote:

---

Twasnt crap, you just didn't like it.

---

I think that it is crap. There's a difference between simply not liking something and thinking that something is of poor quality.

Even when I try to put the major flaws aside what's left is thoroughly generic and mediocre. Nothing about the games seems to have had much thought put into them, they're empty shells of games, thoroughly unremarkable, nothing particularly noteworthy or memorable whatsoever. It feels like instant mix in video game form. Just add water, voila, one Sonic game.

I think most of us agree that Sonic 1-3K and CD are the superior games by far, so what's the point of games that offer us nothing that hasn't been done better ten years ago?

Although I would agree that Sonic 1-3 and CD are generally better, if you dont like lesser games then I have the same question:
Why make Sonic games for the game gear, Sonic 1, 2 Tripple Trouble and Chaos are all lesser quality than the Mega Drive games, why did sega EVER bother making them?

And although their lesser games than Sonic 1-3 I would still put the advance games above thousands of other platformers, platformers which arent considered that bad in the first place.

Quote:

---

Why make Sonic games for the game gear, Sonic 1, 2 Tripple Trouble and Chaos are all lesser quality than the Mega Drive games, why did sega EVER bother making them?

---

The answer to "why" is simply "money". Do I think they should have been made from an artistic view point? Hard to say. The first Master System game was of a decidedly different flavour to the Mega Drive Sonic 1, due to it being developed before that first Sonic game was even released. It's different enough to merit its existence, and was certainly a decent effort considering the format, but was nothing more than a product of its era. As the series progressed it became more like the "big" Sonic games. Sonic 2 was hugely flawed in numerous areas but the latter two games faired well. G Sonic was a disaster from beginning to end. Three decent games were produced, but decent is all they were, all products of their era only notable for their tie-ins with the both critically and commercially successful main series of games over on the Mega Drive.

So on the whole I'd have to say, no, they shouldn't have been made.

Quote:

---

I would still put the advance games above thousands of other platformers, platformers which arent considered that bad in the first place.

---

How many of those "other platformers" play like Sonic games?

Very crazy penguin it isn't fair to compare sonic advance 1-3 to sonics 1-3 and CD. For one the original series are some of the best 2D games ever created. Plus at the time the genesis games let alone sonic CD were created on a state of the art system for their time. While the advance series is on a system that is not state of the art & isn't a home console. So if you are going to compare the advance series to anything compare them to the game gear games. I also think the advance series could have been better but even if they were they'd never be the originals quality. Plus sonic team didn't even make the advance series dimps did.

The Robot King

The Game Boy Advance can handle ports of SNES games with the greatest of ease, so I think it's perfectly fair to compare the series with Mega Drive games from ten years ago.

But even when not comparing them with anything else these are still vastly subpar games in my mind.

They weren't great but they were good handheld games they serve their purpose. About the SNES ports yes the gba can do good ports since its basically a SNES anyway, but even though its similar the advance series aren't ports. So I still say its not fair to compare something that was a state of the art for its time console game to a handheld game of today. Most developers who make handheld games only want to make quick easy money. While back in the genesis days the original series were killer apps so they had to be something great.

The Robot King

Quote:

---

Most developers who make handheld games only want to make quick easy money. While back in the genesis days the original series were killer apps so they had to be something great.

---

I guess that's the crucial difference in our viewpoints then. You're excusing/condining that attitude, whilst I greatly oppose it.

I don't want developers to have this attitude im merly telling the truth. I wanted the advance series to be better thats why im interested in sonic rush. Hopefully rush can succeed where advance failed.

The Robot King

My mistake, coupled with your comment on it not being fair to compare it with "big console" games I took it to mean that you were approving the attitude.

But it seems that some people are more concerned with what isnt there than what is...
I dont approve the attitude that "it's handheld, doesnt matter if we screw it up," but I dont think anyone at Sega approached it like that.

Even if they fail in some respectes you can see what they were trying to do with the games, and I guess I've grown up to take the glass for what it has, half full rather than your half empty.

But pursonally, im glad for them because they've kept 2D Sonic gaming going.
It's just my opinion that they arent that bad games, not just GAMES but they aren't bad Sonic games, just not brilliant ones.

No one sat down saying "lets make a bad Sonic game," it's just the way you think they turned out.

well to be honest my opinion of the Sonic Advance games are mixed.
I tended to like the small touches to the games.
Sonic Advance 1 was a homage to the mega drive games with those special stage springs
Sonic Advance 2 was too fast, awkard special stage coin system, the special stage was a bit strange but was the best of a bad bunch but i loved the R tricks and the skidding game at the end of a level. The levels are huge and there are too many pits
Sonic Advance 3 wasn't Sonic Heroes in 2D.(thank goodness) The team system was ok, i liked it, The find the chao entrance to special stages was the best since the giant rings in Sonic 3 but then the key system was overkill. Gemerl bosses was a homage to Metal Sonic in Sonic 3&K.

Quote:

---

But it seems that some people are more concerned with what isnt there than what is...
I dont approve the attitude that "it's handheld, doesnt matter if we screw it up," but I dont think anyone at Sega approached it like that.

---

They handed their biggest, most recognisable, most profitable, and one of their most critically acclaimed video game series over to Dimps. DIMPS. The geniuses that brought us such classics as The Rumble Fish, the Digimon: BattleSpirit series and the Dragon Ball Z: Budokai series.

Quote:

---

No one sat down saying "lets make a bad Sonic game," it's just the way you think they turned out.

---

It was more like "Let's quickly make a Sonic platformer for GBA without spending much time or money or using our own staff and resources for the bulk of the work."

Thats why hopefully sonic rush will break this mentality, since games that are uninspired don't work well on DS it might make sega put more effort in it.

The Robot King

SA2 y SA3 are the best sonic 2D games of history..They are the faster.Sonic 1 and sonic 2 and CD are very overrate.Specially sonic2,that is a piece of crap(casino night,sky chase,oil ocean sucks).The only 16 bits that are cool is s3&K because is fast.In megadrive games you are constatnly stopped by elements o enemies.
I became fan of sonic not with sonic 1 or sonic 2,but with SA2B.
Advance 2 ,3 and Adventure are the best sonic games because are the faster.
If you want a old school sonic game play SOnic Z which is very dificult o be a hacker and make a new hack.
One of the thing i like more of SA2 is that Sonic has many movements.Only need Light Speed for be perfect.
The unique error i see in the S.advance are the difficulty of the Special Stages(very hard) and that there are many characters.Only with SOnic and other is sufficient,as in S.Rush.I don't mind Tails and Knuckles,they are for pilot machines and seeking Chaos Emeralds.I've never liked them.

Quote:

---

Sonic 1 and sonic 2 and CD are very overrate.

---

BLASPHAMY! Sonic 1, 2 are brilliant games. Sonic CD i found was a bit overhyped (5 years of hype will happen like that, I only played it in 98 i think). Im speachless now.

I think you do like too much speed in your Sonic games seeing how you liked Advance 2 and 3 more than the others and there nothing wrong with that but still you dont say that they are number twos without a long (very long) reason.

>In megadrive games you are constatnly stopped by elements o enemies.

It's true, I was replaying the old games and you dont get stopped by enemies any less than you do in the advance games...
The only difference is in the advance games you WERE going fast, you get stopped and then you have to speed up again..

The old games you were going medium, get stpped and then go medium again, with occasional speedy bits in between.