Sonic the hedgehog has failed becasue it strayed form what made it what it was, that is the acurracy speed and challenge it used to offer. Now the games only challenge is wrestling with the bad gameplay and camera angles. The Sonic Adventure games had a great sense of speed but to often you were denied that great joy and forced FORCED to play horrible gameplay as other characters. When I by a Sonic game I want speed gameplay and thats it. I have always thought "what was wrong with 2d sonic?" the answer is nothing. The game boy advance sonics prove that sonic team is still able to crank out an amazing sonic game and even more they have kicked up the speed. What is so wrong with having a next gen sonic game that has amazing graphics, High speeds, good music, and the 2D accuracy that was lost in the 3D hoopla. Games like Viewtiful Joe have proven that there still is alot a game designer can do with the 2D games in this 3D dominant generation. So imagine a 2D sonic game with twice as many levels as ever seen befor and twice as much speed and beauty and see if it doesnt bring a smile to your face. Imagine the unique gameplay like sonic rush but way better. With this type of game Sonic would get back his former glory and have a unique twist on all other platformers and then he truly would be the king of 2D. Perhaps there is a future for sonic in 3D but that future should not sacrifice quality.
Interesting first post. And by interesting, I mean plz use paragraph breaks kthx. Looks like delicious copy-pasta, though.
And again with the "Sonic is about SPEED" argument. Which I can't really argue with seeing as that was the character's claim to fame, but shouldn't there be equal focus on platforming?
Quote:
The game boy advance sonics prove that sonic team is still able to crank out an amazing sonic game
Except that wasn't Sonic Team.
And the games weren't all that amazing.
They need to stop adding crappy elements that don't belong. I don't want to have different styles of gameplay crammed in one game, they can't even get one style of gameplay right! If they want to make Sonic a turn based strategy game, then fine! Just don't throw in FPS elements along with it.
I agree with Psxphile on that there should be equal focus on platforming, especially after having played Sonic CD recently, one of the few Sonic games I actually enjoy exploring as much as I do speeding through it. I found that while the game doesn't explicity force you to explore (like Sonic Next and that poor excuse for a generic hub town), wanting to make a good future requires you to search for Eggmans machine in the past, and somehow it isn't boring or distracting from the fast speeds you can play the game at. In fact I actually enjoy taking my time in it, a rare occurence for me with any Sonic game which usually feels slow if you're not almost running off screen.
But really, the best way is to just never make another new Sonic game. Sometimes things just get old, have nothing else to give to the world and need to be put down like a retard dog. Is doing what they did with the old games but with more modern technology what anyone wants? Just running and collecting rings wouldn't fly with todays crowd, so I can understand why SEGA throw in these other styles of gameplay and mix it up with a larger cast of characters to cover how bad it really is, but I think that's a definite sign that the original formula is outdated and they either need to find a new style for Sonic that works or just throw in the towel like Rocky (at least until Rocky 7).
Or they could just make the music so good, like in Sonic Rush, that people wont notice how avergae it is. It seemed to work.
Quote:
Or they could just make the music so good, like in Sonic Rush, that people wont notice how avergae it is. It seemed to work.
I love you Spite.
There is no reason why Sonic 06 should have been as bad as it is. Its almost they thought it was going to be released in Xmas 2007, then all of a sudden they got a fax from Sega HQ. I'd like to think that.
I don't think development time was the big problem, and an extra year of development would only have improved control issues at most. The level design, the story, the whole gameplay concept, were awful. Sonic Heroes needed a year of development. Sonic 360 needed to be completely redirected.
Quote:
Or they could just make the music so good, like in Sonic Rush, that people wont notice how avergae it is. It seemed to work.
The sad thing is if it wasn't for the trailer and music samples on the official site I probably would have dismissed it. Though, at least I didn't pay full price thanks to a sale.
And other related news...
The Sonic Syndrome
Here's a sign when your franchise has gone bad--it's based on a internet/gaming slang that deals with something negative.
^ That's just sad right there.
Yes Ashide thank you for that hurtful piece of info. =P I hate how the Sonic series is looked down upon now. Man if only Sega/Sonic Team could redeem the series, but that'd take about 10 amazing Sonic games in a row. That hasn't happened...ever. =O Heck have we even had more than 2 amazing Sonic games in a row since 1992-94[and that actually consisted of just two games considering the fate of Sonic 3] =/. Then again I think Sega/Sonic Team had a shot with Heroes, but they turned the other cheek.
At this point, I feel that it'll take nothing short of a miracle to pull the series out of the sinkhole it's fallen into.
Leave it to me.
It's depressing as a fan but it's not like Sonic Team doesn't deserve it. They been using the Adventure engine and formula for what? Nearly 10 YEARS. What cut it in 1998 isn't going to work in 2007. I say start from scratch and just reboot the franchise. Or have a major cleansing at Sonic Team and fire everyone. Because if this string of bad games keeps up, Sonic will be just another cartoon game hero, like Crash and Spyro, churning out mediocre or unremarkable games each year.
Well here's an article I stumbled upon recently...pinning much of Sega's and Sonic's lost luster on Sammy. Apparently, Sonic Team losing their autonomy was a big reason behind StH's failure.
Loss of autonomy is no excuse for trainwrecks that were Sonic 06 and Sonic Genesis.
You'd think that, autonomy or not, Sonic Team would be able to decently port a game that they created. And you can't tell me that Sammy made them disregard all the glitches and horrendous load times that plagued Sonic 06.
Sonic Battle 2, plz.
I got two things to say: first Sonic Battle 2 would be awesome, and second: Why doesn't anybody respond to my posts in this thread? I've already done three posts here, all largely ignored. I know on a forum it's expected, but it's getting annoying.
Back to the topic, do you think the Sonic franchise will die off because of this? I'm not saying it could right now, but let's say ten years down the road we keep getting crappy games, and Sonic continues to lose more of his original fanbase, would Sega just dump the hedgehog snd come up with another mascot? There are a lot of cases of would-be long franchises getting straight killed off by a series of bad games or just one awful game. Sonic is still popular, but he's losing credibility. Would Sega pull the plug on Sonic if this cycle of games continues?
It's arguably already dead, and it is in a zombie state because the games still sell.
Yes Sonic Battle was a surprise for me, although it wasn't great I was expecting a lot worse. I was basically expecting Digimon Battle Spirit, also made by Dimps... then again Digimon games generally suck.
With some improvements and maybe Solid Snake thrown in for a little showtime, I'd totally buy a sequel.
You'd think that, autonomy or not, Sonic Team would be able to decently port a game that they created. And you can't tell me that Sammy made them disregard all the glitches and horrendous load times that plagued Sonic 06.
I don't think that Sonic Genesis was ported by Sonic Team, but instead by another group (who, for good reason, seemed to want their names left off the box). Sega/Sammy just slapped ST's name on it for recognition. And don't try to argue that Sammy's ruthless methods of saving a buck wasn't a big factor in Sonic 2006's failure. It was Sammy who fired the debugging team before release, it was Sammy who demanded the game make the holiday deadline, and it was Sammy who encouraged cutting the corners that led to the horrid production values.
Actual, credible source please?
Source or it didn't happen.
If Sega wants to continue on their path of the 'store brand version of a Final Fantasy story plot' then they need to either do some research into what makes a story good or fire all of their current writers and hire new ones.
If you're going to give another Sonic game a story. For the love of swiss cheese don't make Shadow a primary character. He's cool and all but Shadow's presence just screws up sense 1000 fold.
-Please do not make unlikeable and forgettable characters walking plot devices. It makes us despise them more.
- Please do not push two characters into "flirtatious budding romance" that seems gross and largely out of place.
- At all costs don't make the story difficult to understand unless the genre of mystery is on purpose. And if it is on purpose then make sure the lack of knowledge is fun for the player not annoying like a plot hole.
Actual, credible source please?
Source? Just read the article I posted earlier. Sure, it's an editorial, but much of what it says is grounded in fact.
It's just better for some if you state a source so that we readers know where it came from. For all we know that quote may be your own eventhough it does sound truthful. Just link the page you got the quote from.
Sigh...if you insist...the following is a quote from Lucas DeWoody's piece I linked to earlier:
Sonic Team had been long promising a reboot for the Sonic franchise, seeing that their recent efforts were highly lacking. This game was to be Sonic the Hedgehog, developed for Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3. Expectations were understandably high from people hoping that Sega had learned from their mistakes, but overwhelming pressure from management to cut corners, save money, and make the holiday release date would prevent this from being so. In 2006, a good percentage of Segas American debugging department was laid off. The game was so broken that it teetered on the edge of being unplayable. Sonic the Hedgehog was undoubtedly Sonic Teams greatest failure, and perhaps Segas biggest flop. Not only was it a bad game, but it was a bad game starring the company mascot, which in turn tarnished the company image as a whole.
And concerning Sonic Genesis being developed by someone besides Sonic Team:
The most notorious example might be last years Game Boy Advance port of Genesis classic Sonic the Hedgehog, the game that built Segas fortunes in the 90s. The title was published under the Sonic Team name for the sake of brand recognition, and development was farmed out to a third party team who apparently didn't wish to be credited for the work.
Doesn't exactly mean that Sammy are soley responsible for the rush job. I mean Sega historically rushed Sonic games in the past(y helo thar Sonic 3/S&K and Sonic Adventure), buggy games(Sonic Heroes) or put out half-assed port jobs before Sammy Corp(sup SA
X).
Does Sega even run tests on their games? I mean AT ALL. I mean isnt it impossible for a game to be released without even a little testing? It seems that their biggest problem IS that they rush to finish games.
A scarier thought is that they don't care. @ DB
In the end the only definate idea I can come up with to make Sega straighten up their act is if fans go on a serious strike and not buy any more of their games. I know this is impossible but I was just thinking that instead of buying the games fans would only rent.
Gunpoint
Gunpoint? What does that mean?
Sega being held at gunpoint and being forced to make a good Sonic game. 
Quote:
In the end the only definate idea I can come up with to make Sega straighten up their act is if fans go on a serious strike and not buy any more of their games. I know this is impossible but I was just thinking that instead of buying the games fans would only rent.
This is impossible because the majority of people who plays Sonic games are same ones who play such titles as Hanna Montana, Shrek the Third, and other kiddie licenced drek.
XDXD! Yea no joke...if you want that old school quality Sonic used to have...well thats exactly what you'll have to do...stick to old school. Until ST gets it together, if that day ever comes.
we must kidnap de cheeeldreeen....
O_o Sonic and Amy had kids?! *stabbed*
So far I like the gunpoint idea. In fact, I want someone right now, to get a flight ticket, go to Japan, buy a gun, and hold Sonic Team at gunpoint. And stay there until the good Sonic game's finished. Come on, who's with me? Any volunters? Anybody? *invests in Japanese flight tickets*
Anyway, I think the Sonic franchise's problem at the moment is the fans. If the new Sonic fans are the Hanna Montana fans, then the series is doomed. Maybe Sonic should take a break for several years and comeback. It's worked for Batman and Lara Croft.
^ I agree.
A hiatus would be a very wise choice for Sonic. Sega said that they were, but we know how that turned out.
As it stands right now, to paraphrase a poster on the GHZ, the Sonic franchise has been beaten, raped, shot, and left for dead. Does Sega or Sonic Team even care anymore? I'm in the camp that the fans are to blame. Kids nowadays will buy anything regardless of the quality, and to Sega: quanity >>>>> quality.
Sonic was the first series I latched onto after our Atari died. It's depressing to see what he's become. I hate to feel this way, but if this trend continues, I'll be advocating going ahead and putting Sonic out of his misery.
Dear Lord, I sound like one of those old men who are constantly whining about the younger generation.
Sega can't seemed to keep a promise. They say they want to recapture the Genesis feeling and they give us "Sonic Heroes", then they say they want to keep Sonic fresh and then they give "Shadow", and then they finally say that they going to reboot the franchise, restore Sonic's glory, and redefine speed and then they give Sonic 2006, which continued the convoluted SA story, make Sonic lose any credibilty he had left, and make an unbroken piece of mess. Sega should just let the series recover from the bombardment of bad games and just completely fire everyone associated with said bad games. Get fresh talent, start anew, test the game, and don't be afraid to don't be afraid to push back the game. Mario and Zelda are known for their delays, and every game true to their genre end up being classics.
Sega should just let the series recover from the bombardment of bad games and just completely fire everyone associated with said bad games. Get fresh talent, start anew, test the game, and don't be afraid to don't be afraid to push back the game.
A nice idea...but it isn't going to happen. Not with the way Sega/Sammy likes to do business. After the Sammy takeover, the company changed their business model into something resembling what EA does, becoming more of a publisher, and playing more to the company's strengths. But the truth is, they're closer to Atari than EA. Atari was once a distinguished name in the gaming industry, but now they're an out of touch publisher releasing half-assed games that sell only on brand or franchise recognition. Sounds more and more like Sega if you ask me. Hell, the milking continues...the existence of Sonic Rivals 2 was just confirmed by the big gaming sites today.
And if the new Sonic fanbase are the same as those into Hannah Montana, then I weep for the series' future.
Quote:
Atari was once a distinguished name in the gaming industry, but now they're an out of touch publisher releasing half-assed games that sell only on brand or franchise recognition.
Actually, this sounds like EA to me.
It sounds like them both. Man...what's up with all these publishers/developers nowadays. They've just gotten so lazy...for the most part.
Fine, is there any way someone could BUY Sonic from Sega? It seems to me that we aren't still not going to get any good Sonic games, ironically, if Sega still holds the franchise. I've suggested this before, maybe Sonic should go comepletely with Nintendo. Sonic 2006 proved that most of his fanbase is there.
Actually, this sounds like EA to me.
EA isn't as out of touch as Atari and Sega. I hate them, but they still know when it's time to make a good game and get it marketed to the masses.
You know the games are getting bad when Sonic himself says they suck.
That must be why he left when you let him stand there in Sonic CD.
If he left a fantastic game like CD, I can't imagine how he stomach being in Sonic360.
Hahaha I guess Sonic has actually been MIA since CD and the one we've played as in the games following has only been a clone. 
